I was a dirty fucking hippie, I'm proud to say. More of a yippie, actually. ("A yippie was a hippie that had been arrested" and politicized.)
The Greens were right too, they were on global warming and the need for change back when to do so was to put you in the fringe of the fringe.
So now, as you say, all that's needed is the will to change. And it's coming.
So, for all the DFHs out there, do what the European eco-Left did when the Right tried to slime them by calling them watermelons (green on the outside, red on the inside)- they used it as a compliment.
Posted by Bob Morris at January 5, 2008 09:02 AMThe hippie movement only looks better and better as time goes by---an actual non materialist, existential, intellectual movement that had an enormous following in youthful America. Remarkable and impressive.
Times of great sacrifice for ordinary people are coming, like it or not. Peak oil, climate destruction and massive wealth collapse will wreak havoc on our bloated standard of living.
One might as well be a voluntary, contemplative non-materialist (like the DFHs), as opposed to a bitter, coerced non-materialist, eh?
Posted by euzoius at January 5, 2008 09:10 AMGlenn Greenwald discerns a relationsahip:
The level of debate a policy receives is inversely related to it's significance. "...that is, the more significant the policy is, the less political debate and media attention it receives. So not only do our most destructive policies continue regardless of the outcome of our elections, they continue without any real democratic deliberation at all."
For example, military spending:
"Our military spending exceeds the rest of the world's spending combined, and we spend almost 10 times what the second-place country, China, spends...Our permanent war culture not only means that we fight far more wars than anyone else, with far less of a threat required to trigger such wars...It is also the case that the opportunity costs for this state of affairs are enormous..."
"Obviously, all of the leading Fox News Republican presidential candidates advocate a continuation and worsening of this state of affairs. And so do the leading Democratic presidential candidates:
Hillary Clinton: 'expand and modernize the military'
John Edwards: 'double the budget for recruitment'...'increase our investment in the maintenance of our equipment'
Barack Obama: 'revitalize our military'...'expand our ground forces by adding 65,000 soldiers to the army and 27,000 marines'...'We must also consider using military force in circumstances beyond self-defense.'
The bipartisan consensus on US military spending by Glenn Greenwald
Glenn Greenwald's Unclaimed Territory, Salon, Wed Jan 2, 2008
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/01/02/military_spending/index.html
Thanks for taking up this issue and posting this.
The way-back hippies were joined by some great musicians who gave great voice to the issues. I see some of these guys hobbling to the stage again but have I missed this generation's great protest musicians?
If there's any doubt the power of music, rent the DVD or see it on the History Channel, Paul McCartney in Red Square and the history of how generations of Russians fell in love with the Beatles to the great horror of their leaders.
You're right, it's all about leadership.
Posted by mainsailset at January 5, 2008 09:52 AMwas at woodstock..and was in haight ashbury in the early 70's...dirty fucking hippie i was...i remember eating at a mission..found out years later..it was jim jones...those were the days
Posted by dennis at January 5, 2008 10:04 AMJim Jones...now that was a close call!
Yeah, in those days, no I/tubes, just the power of presence with protest marches set to the beat of incredible music.
Good to remember and often forgotten, was that the hippie movement grew out of rebellion against authoritarianism it saw in its parents' generation.
It was a time of unbridled corporate and state greed, civil rights movement was raw, birth control pills allowed for huge freedoms of choice and the hippies set aside their parents' dreams for them. Just walked away. It seemed so unAmerican, so crass. But it was a time of choice.
Probably moreso than any time in our history. And today, their legacy of questioning authority still rings true.
My (former?) best friend, 66 year old former Air Force FAC driver, very smart coauthor of a nuclear winter study read by Congress, wonderful step-father to two young boys in a second marriage, includes me in a group (DFH) he calls stupid, from his high perch of superior intelligence and experience. I asked him to read people like Glenn G, many others who help frame the debate from the left, but he says he can't read anymore. When asked how he makes his decisions on matters important to our democracy he answers that he "trusts" Bush and his policies. Hmmm, that reads faith, to me. And that perfectly describes all the right wing pundits and intelligentsia, the ignorant 25% who ignore facts, or make up their own simply because their faith-constrained partisan heads are firmly implanted up their asses. I may be stupid, but my friends, you are ignorant. Stupid I can't change, for your ignorance there is no excuse.
Posted by jimbo at January 5, 2008 11:38 AMThe 6'1" part I'll buy. The body fat for someone who posts on the Innertubes though is obviously a lie. :)
I don't know if anyone else has really noted this, but I've actually felt like the caucus this last week was very much one of those moments when larger society embraced the demand that the nation has to change, while at the same time dismissing the messenger who's been singing his lungs out for years.
It's left me with a very mixed feeling, being a self-identified DFH who likes monogamous hetero sex, regular morning showers, meat entrees, and holds down a regular well-paying job.
I've got reservations about how this apparent rising coalition calling for change. There's a very definite tone of "all are welcome at the table" that is one of those things that I admire about liberal Christian theology. At the same time, Obama has also promised that if the powers-that-have-been continue to fight change, they're going to be 'politely moved to the side.' It's all well and good - but where do you dis-invite the gasoline and oil industires? Where's the thin red line? The first time they can't (or won't) to meet carbon standards? When they refuse to rebuild their companies into models of distribution for other energies? The first time an oil lobbyist sits in front of White House Staffers and tells them to shut the fuck up because they own the President's next election?
Posted by idiosynchronic at January 5, 2008 12:15 PMAs a clean (used Herbal Essence shampoo on my long blond hair) Palo Alto hippie back in the late 60s and early 70s, I am happy to see Obama and Edwards rising to the top of the Democratic 2008 Presidential candidates. We were right about ending the Vietnam war; We were right about ending racism; We were right to challenge government authority; We were right about showing concern about the destruction of the natural environment...
Carry on,
Posted by james k. sayre at January 5, 2008 12:30 PMBeing right correctamundo 30-40 years ago don't mean shit now. Saul Alinsky worked to organize the ethnic (white) disenfranchised in Chicago, and then had to go back 20 years later to to organize against the racism of those he had organised 20 years earlier.
Moral of the story: Keep on truckin'
Posted by superannuatedbeatnick at January 5, 2008 01:06 PMI may be a white boy, but this post by lowermanhttanite almost perfectly recreates my feelings that night after the caucus.
I watched The Speech on local news in my basement, while putting up comments on TLC. It was A Moment. And there was this later feeling of . . if the Secret Service thought he was endangered months ago, those boys just had their workload quadrupled.
Posted by idiosynchronic at January 5, 2008 02:21 PM"The Hippies Were Right"
....the kiling fields of Cambodia and the re-education camps in Vietnam. But, hey, what's a few million dead little brown people: it is the price they paid so you may bask in a sense of moral superiority.
"There was an America for 100 years without gasoline engines, and there will be again one day."
Sure. So tell me paradox, will you be the first to embrace the Amish way of life?
The foolishness of this post begins with the title and carries right on through to the final paragraph....
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 02:25 PM"....the kiling fields of Cambodia and the re-education camps in Vietnam. But, hey, what's a few million dead little brown people: it is the price they paid so you may bask in a sense of moral superiority."
.....the killing fields of Iraq and the torture chambers of Abu. Buy, hey, what's a few million dead little brown towelheads: it is the price they pay so Bush can bask in his sense of moral superiority."
Posted by Judith at January 5, 2008 03:46 PMYuppies, to us, where rich white kids trying to be like us hippies.
Posted by Judith at January 5, 2008 03:49 PM
"... few million dead little brown towelheads..."
Still creating your own reality, Judith?
"Yuppies, to us, where rich white kids trying to be like us hippies."
Still incapable of forming a single coherent post?
(Still dumb as a bag of hammers.)
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 04:00 PMsome things never change, bagless will be an ignorant, fascist loving asswipe to his dying breath...
Posted by headxray at January 5, 2008 04:09 PM"...bagless will be an ignorant...."
How so, headxray? Were the Cambodian killing fields a falsehood? Were there not re-education camps in Vietnam? Are these things not true?
Or is it the case that you are simply an ignorant and uneducated Leftist?
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 04:17 PMcome back to the present oh bagless asshole..it is far more relevant that a chimp apologist and criminal party supporter like you is by definition...a useless, ignorant, corrupt, criminal asshole...face the facts asswipe...you and yours are a dying breed...
Posted by headxray at January 5, 2008 04:25 PM"come back to the present oh bagless asshole..it is far more relevant that a chimp apologist and criminal party supporter like you is by definition...a useless, ignorant, corrupt, criminal asshole...face the facts asswipe...you and yours are a dying breed..."
No answer to the question, headxray. Just simply invective.
Well, nothing else was to be expected.
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 04:33 PMinvective and complete, utter contempt are exactly what you batch of fascists have earned yourselves...it is impossible to find anything lower than a puke apologist...expect nothing more than you have earned and deserve...what should be expected from someone who supports a terrorist such as the chimp and his sidekick shooter?
Posted by headxray at January 5, 2008 04:39 PM"invective and complete, utter contempt are exactly what you batch of fascists have earned yourselves...it is impossible to find anything lower than a puke apologist...expect nothing more than you have earned and deserve...what should be expected from someone who supports a terrorist such as the chimp and his sidekick shooter?"
More invective?
Something original, please. But originality is probably beyound your mean and meaningless life. (However, that begs a question: exactly how many of my taxayer dollars do you hoover-up each year to support your miserable existence?)
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 04:48 PMBagley, you continue to tie these Lads and Ladies in knots.
Playground rhetoric responses as evidence.
Good job Ol BOY !!
Posted by jj at January 5, 2008 04:54 PMjj, sometimes this forum is only marginally more entertaining than watching a television commercial for motor oil.
Well, folks, THE game is on!
I will stop in during the commercials. (That should provide headxray with sufficient time to finish his dinner of navel lint and litter box leavings.)
Thanks!
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 05:04 PMjust what I expect from those who love violence and terrorism...talk about original..jj and bagless make a great pair..you 2 cohabitating or just sharing a mutual admiration society for losers? it is no surprise to find you two apologizing for the same old, tired bullshit...true good old boys is right...
Posted by headxray at January 5, 2008 05:20 PMheadxray,
How was dinner?
Regards,
bagley
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 05:24 PMhow's that working out for you bagBOY? the legend in your own mind stuff...
Posted by headxray at January 5, 2008 06:24 PM"...how's that working out for you bagBOY? the legend in your own mind stuff..."
Huh?
Off your meds....or was it something you ate for dinner?
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 06:26 PMMaking my point, but keep trying.
Posted by jj at January 5, 2008 06:28 PMHalftime.
Hey, thanks to TLC for the bandwidth.
Goodnight all.
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 06:52 PM....the kiling fields of Cambodia and the re-education camps in Vietnam. But, hey, what's a few million dead little brown people: it is the price they paid so you may bask in a sense of moral superiority.
I'd give you another history lesson bagless but it would fall on deaf ears. You want to believe what you have heard from ru$h and the bu$h administration.
Blame the DFH for the Killing Fields and re-education camps in Vietnam? LOL!
It was more like America's dirty little secret, "black ops" that caused this happen.
When will you realize that the profit from perpetual warfare is what America was about at that time. It still continues.
"The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power."
- - Franklin D. Roosevelt
"I'd give you another history lesson bagless but it would fall on deaf ears. You want to believe what you have heard from ru$h and the bu$h administration."
Hey, 7of6, hiding in the background until I was gone?
Remember, I am an immigrant from SE Asia, circa ~ 1976.
What "history lesson" do you want to give me that I do not know from personal experience?
Please, do tell....
And do tell again...
And again...
And one more time, idiot child...One. More. Time.
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 07:14 PMhey bagboy, get back to us AFTER you quit wetting the bed..you're getting wet brain from it...
Posted by headxray at January 5, 2008 07:28 PM"hey bagboy, get back to us AFTER you quit wetting the bed..you're getting wet brain from it..."
Old...and very old.
Hey 7of6 any "history lesson" you want to provide?
One. More. Time?
Please do....
Posted by Bagley at January 5, 2008 07:44 PMbag boy whats really getting old is moron's like you and jj defending criminals like your hero the chimp..more hero worship from a pack of bedwetting adolescents..
Posted by headxray at January 5, 2008 07:56 PMRemember, I am an immigrant from SE Asia, circa ~ 1976.
Sure you are Baggy. And I'm from Iraq.
Seven of Six and Headxray, taunting is Baggy's favorite pass time, but that is what bullies do. He comes here to build up his low self-esteem, believing that by putting us down (as if he could), he has elevated himself to some delusional place of importance. How pathetic.
Hey 7of6 any "history lesson" you want to provide?
One. More. Time?
Well, if I recall it was when you said that "Ray-gun" had won the Cold War! I corrected you then and taught you the truth. Which you ignored.
But then again I'm tired of dealing with a troll who believes in republi-con revisionist history.
If you want to talk about the supposedly secret American bombing runs of Cambodia that killed 600,000 to 800,000. That eventually forced Cambodia against the United States then lets go for it. I want to hear your revisionist history on that one.
Posted by Seven of Six at January 6, 2008 07:45 AMSeven of six, Ray-gun ended the cold war? This is about the 14th time Baggy has made that ridiculous statement, and he calls me "dumb?"
Posted by Judith at January 6, 2008 09:16 AM
Bagley, last I checked, it was those Vietnamese who stopped the genocide/fratricide in Cambodia. And it was assholes like Kissinger and Nixon who helped cause it -- laws of unintended consequences. And assholes like Reagan diplomatically cozied up to the Cambodian Khmer Rouge perpetrators of the genocide, no longer in charge of Phnom Penh, in the early '80s as a matter of Cold War policy. I'm pleased to inform you, Bagley, the Dirty Fucking Hippies were and continue to be right. And you obviously don't know or even begin to understand recent history, Bagley, ignorance typical of the right wing.
I'm a bit too young to have truly been a Hippie, but damn I sure would have been if I could have been. Politically, inasmuch as the hippies had politics, the hippies were and are the closest to my political ideals. From the SDS before it metastasized to Kesey's admonitions to turn your back on it and onto the White Panther Party's insanity, somewhere between all those is closest to where my political heart lies.
Of course, being right as the DFH were and are is cold comfort. Look at the state of that group's true political leadership -- the diverse group of folks once known as "The New Left." So many of them are just teachers now, totally outside the levers of power in this country, and those are the lucky ones. Many others are dead. Tom Hayden a college instructor in California. Todd Gitlin a semi-respected leftist journalist and a prof at Columbia. Bobby Seale, a community activist and ex-con. John Sinclair living in exile. Mario Savio, dead. The cultural leadership is in worse shape, though it seems to have had longer lasting impact.
Anyone who ever thinks there needs to be real alternatives to Dems and Republicans ought to note what happened to these people. The bi-partisan system ground these talented, talented people to death or surrender. That is what happens in AmeriKKKa to people who truly question the basic assumptions on which the two-party system and this country are built.
If there were any justice in this world, Alan Haber would be the current baby boomer president of the U.S., not the sick bastard there now; Emmett Grogan would be the Treasury Secretary; Owsley would be Sec. Energy; Ron Kovic would be Sec. Defense; and everyone would know these people's names as well as the names of the next American Idol contestants.
Posted by Brian Bell at January 6, 2008 10:19 PMWell said Brian Bell.
Posted by Judith at January 7, 2008 02:14 AModd that bagless bagley would bring up Cambodia and Vietnam
where was Bush and Cheney then? oh yeah, Bush was coked out and Cheney had "other priorities"
I'm tired of right-wing cowardice masquerading as patriotism.
Thank you, Judith.
Posted by Brian Bell at January 7, 2008 12:05 PMI worked for McGovern in 1972. So did Bill and Hillary. McGovern has endorsed Hillary for 2008.
Now is our chance to go on with what we started in 1972. The same people.
In 92 we made a good start till the GOP got Congress in 94. Now we have a good chance to get Congress as well as the White House.
If we don't make the same mistakes McGovern made in 72, we have a chance to get Bill and Hillary back in now, and make the race safe for Obama 2016.
Yeah, it's definately about leadership.
The people need leaders to open up their eyes to the truth that they're denying. They need to realise that the power of making big decisions is not in the hands of the people, even though it should be.
Disgusting plutocrats and corporate parasites have taken the "thrown" and left us on the bottom to shine their shoes. It's about damn time it's done.
There needs to be a second hippy revolution.
A "Bohemian Restoration" if you will?