Which brings to mind the scene in Fahrenheit 911 where John Conyers explains to an incredulous Michael Moore (wrt The PATRIOT Act) that lawmakers never read the legislation they're voting on.
Posted by kaleidescope at September 23, 2008 12:50 PMHi. Remember me? I posted here a lot until a couple weeks ago. The negativity here got me down. I kept telling all of you that the McCain bounce was temporary and that the polls were going to shift Obama's way. I predicted a 4-6% Obama victory although McCain was ahead almost everywhere.
Just dropped back in to see this post. I have to admit I'm watching this financial crisis like a hawk because I have a huge personal stake. I can't say how it will turn out but I will tell you, as I've said before regarding the media and Palin, that this time it is different. This isn't a replay of the Patriot Act or the AUMF. This isn't a replay of FISA. The dynamics are vastly different.
First, consider the major media players. They personally didn't give a rat's ass about FISA or the Patriot Act, and the AUMF made their jobs more interesting. But they are very, very personally invested in NOT having their personal fortunes lost in another 1929-32 market meldown.
Second, consider that no one -- and I mean NO ONE -- trusts Bush's administration anymore. Even Gingrich is out against this bailout. Republicans are even out there hoping Bush will fool the Democrats to vote for it, then Republicans can run against it. Even the Democrats seem to have figured this out. Again, it's not FISA, which the Democrats rightly realized most of the population was going to ignore in November. They know this is critical, not only to their election strategy but also to their governing after the election.
This means that some other plan is going to be hashed out -- not what Bush wants. I don't know what that plan will be, which is why I'm watching so closely. But I'm guessing it will be similar in effect to the RTC from the S&L bailout. The culprits will still get away with having caused this disaster, but the plan will be reasonably effective at addressing the causes. And the Democrats aren't going to be rushed into it because the polls are solidly against the Republicans on this crisis.
Now, regarding the election in general:
First, I echo my previous points that the MSM is not going to be in the tank for McCain like it was for Bush between 1999-2005. There are many reasons for this, the cheif being that the most influential leaders of the country are forming a concensus behind an Obama presidency (Warren Buffett is tremendously influential). McCain is worrying them, and Palin frankly freaks them out. Obama, by playing the centrist card so frequently and often, has entered the comfort zone of the inflential leaders. This means that an Obama presidency won't be a huge win for a progressive agenda, but OTOH it will probably be reasonable and pragmatic, which right now would be a welcome relief.
Second, do consider that Obama is doing better now in the polls than Reagan was doing at this time in 1980. The situations were similar: pessimistic voters, horrible economic numbers, disasterous foreign policy news. Yet the voters had not warmed to Reagan, although unlike Obama Reagan was running against the actual incumbent, not a candidate who was from the incumbent's party. After the first debate the remaining undecideds moved steadily to Reagan based on the economy and the need for the change.
I've been talking to undecideds here in Colorado, and in my experience the same thing is poised to happen in this election. The economy is the key issue. They have doubts about Obama, but even bigger ones about McCain. They know McCain is closely associated with Bush, who they dislike (or worse), and they have negative views of Palin.
It will happen. Obama by 6-8%
Posted by Anonny at September 23, 2008 12:59 PMThe election will likely turn on what happens with this Bush bailout. If McCain is permitted to oppose it while Obama idiotically supports it, he's a goner.
If Dems side with Bushco, approve a bailout of the nation's financial crooks, and do not force Paulson and Bernanke to repeat in painful detail exactly what meltdown they are claiming will happen absent the bailout, then Repubs will vote en masse against it and Obama and the Dems will lose. The Dems may even lose the Congress.
It's starting to look like more super-secret "wish we could tell you the extreme danger but we can't" chicanery by Bushco, and Dems are falling for it (again).
We desperately need to know what Bushco and the Fed have been telling Congress. Dems refuse to say. If we don't find out, and Dems approve any form of $700 billion bailout while Repubs are allowed to oppose it, then Dems are certain to lose---the whole ballgame. This could very well be the Repubs Hail Mary pass.
Bushco, Paulson and Bernanke may even be pulling the whole thing as a political trap. These professional Repubs are not beyond anything. Destroying the country to win the election would be NOTHING for them.
Posted by euzoius at September 23, 2008 02:10 PMOne Final time: there is absolutely NO REASON to do one damn thing Bush tells us we should do. Whether by design (which I suspect in most cases) or sheer incompetence (the remaining cases) the Conservative Republican hierarchy acting with and through Bush and Cheney have completely screwed up this Nation. STOP. STOP. STOP doing what he says. Period. The man is a damned dead duck. Do not do anything about anything until he is gone.
Posted by T2 at September 23, 2008 02:17 PMYou lost the bottom feeders when you quoted Dostoevsky, Turkana. Don't you know we're back at war with the Russia?
Posted by idiosynchronic at September 23, 2008 03:39 PMidio,
the bottom feeders have been strangely quiet, the past week or so...
Posted by Turkana at September 23, 2008 03:41 PMI think its a dog and pony show just to strip the last bit of wealth they can from us all. They are now admitting that the plans have been in the works for months (even when they were saying all was well back in July) They realize that the Repubs are out of power for probably a generation and they have to make their move while they can.
Posted by dianne at September 23, 2008 04:01 PM