its good that obama is equating health care costs with the economy, tying it into the auto industry is real real smart. we help with health care, they can focus on improving their bottom line, this is really easy to apply across the business spectrum... its good that he's inviting everyone to the table to develop this policy, differing opinion and not group think will craft a more effective health care plan. to those who believe socialized medicine is bad, think of how much you'd pay if your wife spend 9 days in icu and 21 total days in the hospital, with kidney failure and acute respiratory distress syndrome (high mortality rate). it seems when you take the profit out of medicine, folks interests seem to be in the actual cure. i remember getting allergy shots to increase tolerance to symptoms, when i went to the hmo, well, the shots ended (too expensive) but here, take this claritin at $40.00 a bottle $15 with insurance, for 30 days, 4 refills, then come back and see me so i can bill you give you 4 more refills, rinse, repeat. no cure, just manage symptoms. health care is broke in our country. bout time it comes round to the rest of the world....
Posted by anthony at March 5, 2009 11:35 AMthe forces of the "status quo" are starting to mobilize, now that they see Obama means business. On MSNBC Alan Greenspan's wife has spent her interview time the last two days trying to get someone on the Dem side to say "with all the other problems, Obama is biting off too much trying to get Health Care done also".
Nobody's taken the bait yet, pointing out that now is the time and Health Care is a huge part of the economic picture. But the fact she's kept at it underscores how much the old guard is starting to see, well, Change. It scares the hell out of a lot of people.
Obamachrist and the Socialists in Congress are betting that 16 years is long enough to reintroduce the notion of universal health care to America. And, indeed, our numbers have swelled enough since that time to make it a safe bet: the country now teems with millions more who do not care about America except as a teat at which they may feed. The cocksuckers in Big Media are surely on board and there's enough momentum from 2008 to pull it off, so it looks like it's going to happen.
It is a misfortunate accident of History that the party that emancipated Black Americans now stands wrongly accused of racism for criticizing a black President who leads the party of slavery, secession, segregation, and Socialism like the demagogic bore he is. The Democratic Party is the party of the happy totalitarian and the kept bitch.
Can't wait for 2010.
Posted by Toby Petzold at March 5, 2009 01:42 PMahh but toby, but 4 years ago, to criticize the president and his policies was deemed unpatriotic. so, by this def, are you then sir unpatriotic. and for your party of bigots comment, funny how history changes, your party is the most homogenic party out of the two. what is the ratio of white men in your party. the dem party looks more like america than the repubs. i'm sure you can google the rallies of barack and compare them to the rallies of mccain.
your party is morally bankrupt. no ideas but plenty of criticism. tell me toby, where were you when gwb drove us off a cliff? were you shouting as much then? where were you and those of your party when gwb slept on 9/11 or took his many vacations to crawford? what are your party's plans for the country? tax cuts sure as hell didn't work.
the difference between this president as the last not including the vast difference in intelligence, is the fact that he's willing to listen to other points of view. when did gwb get any opinion from someone other than a sychphant?
your president ran a dictatorship, the documents are rising to the top of the shit heap to prove it.
oh, if you are such an opponent for socialism, please renounce your right for police protection, fire protection, and protection from our military.
you use big words, but the definitions seem to escape you.
btw. read up on it, lincoln was a racist too; however keeping the country together was more important than his personal ideals....
cue the sound of crickets.
Posted by anthony at March 5, 2009 01:56 PMToby, old chap, however much you may hate the idea of universal healthcare, the fact is that countries who have it, are better places to live in than the USA. America is ranked about thirtieth in the league table of life expectancy. It has one of the highest rates of prostate cancer. It has been overtaken as the world's tallest people by the Netherlands, where there is, guess what, universal healthcare. It's quite comforting to think my horrid "socialist" British lifespan has a statistically good chance of exceeding yours!
Posted by Colin at March 5, 2009 02:16 PMAnthony:
oh, if you are such an opponent for socialism, please renounce your right for police protection, fire protection, and protection from our military.
Why? Because those are exclusively Socialist institutions?
BTW, is it possible for white people to criticize Obama without being falsely accused of racism?
Anthony, there's no reason to expect any different treatments with universal. No cures, just maintenance...HMO style. Cures went out in the 70's, today's medicine, like Eri's post a few days ago, isn't broadly into cures. There's a few, a minority doing research to find better things, but those are few and far between. I believe, if you look at either the NHS or Canadian Medicare, neither are doing to well. They may be marginally better, but at what cost. Try finding some other model. A single payer for those uninsured may be nice, but only to a baseline, like the Swiss.
Posted by peter at March 5, 2009 03:24 PMTobes,
You guys have bastardized the term "socialism" so badly that you don't even understand the concept anymore.
Socialism ≠ reigning in business such that it stops unmitigated greed over people's health.
But you guys are infinitely entertaining. Did you catch Rep. Wamp on MSNBC today?
Posted by Simp at March 5, 2009 03:47 PMWhats wrong with Socialism?....it's a perfectly good system.
Posted by Parallax at March 5, 2009 04:41 PM...the country now teems with millions more who do not care about America except as a teat at which they may feed.
Since you're not paying attention, let me clue you in.
Since 1993 we've come to a point where half of all bankruptcies are the result of bills associated with illnesses. The majority of these people had healthcare plans provided by their employers.
47 million adults don't have any form of health insurance.
The insurance industry has made denying benefits a business practice to swell their bottom lines. The practice is to deny treatment and force the insured to litigate to access benefits they've payed for. Many procedures that once required hospital stays are now outpatient procedures. As an example, my sister in-law is having a hysterectomy. They will remove her uterus and send her home the same day. When my mother had hers she stayed 9 days in the hospital.
Insurers make it a practice to exclude those who have had previous health problems, or if benefits are available they are priced beyond the ability of a person to pay for them. I have the most common form of heart ailment there is. It's not related to lifestyle. 10% of all people have it, and it is so innocuous many have it and don't know it. It is treated at the massive cost of $16.00 per month and my prognosis is no worse than someone without it. If I had to change employer or go on my own I CAN'T get health insurance because of it.
The AVERAGE annual family premium is $12,680.00 dollars per year.
And that is why we will have nationalized healthcare this time around. The insurance industry...and you...broke the system.
The cost to administer Medicare's drug benefit by a corporate insurer is 9.8% of the benefit total. Government does it for 1.7%. The VA comes in at half that. Take the profit motive of the the private insurer out of the equation and things immediately get cheaper.
Canadian Medicare, neither are doing to well. They may be marginally better, but at what cost. Try finding some other model. A single payer for those uninsured may be nice, but only to a baseline, like the Swiss.
The gibberish of the stupid. You would help yourself by being better read.
Posted by phidipides at March 5, 2009 08:24 PMMother Jones had something to say about healthcare authored by David Corn: White House Freak Out?
"On Thursday afternoon, as the White House summit on health care reform was ending, a parade of Washington pooh-bahs moved from the Old Executive Office Building, past the outside of the West Wing, to the front entrance of the White House for a final meeting, where President Barack Obama would hold a seminar-like session. ("Senator Mitch McConnell, got any thoughts to share?") As I watched Sen. Chris Dodd, Sen. Jay Rockefeller, Rep. Henry Waxman and others strolling along, I spotted a senior administration official who handles economic issues. He, too, was heading to the East Wing, and he was holding a collection of thick briefing books.
"Having fun?" I asked.
"Any time I'm not working on AIG and Citibank, it's a good day," he said. "Health care is fun compared to that. Believe me, I'm glad to be out of the office doing this.""
He goes on...
""We can come up with all sorts of solutions," he said. "But it's the economy." He noted that he and other administration aides are working around the clock, that every day he jumps from one crisis to another, and that he feels that he and other administration policymakers have plenty of latitude to craft innovative responses to the assorted economic problems. Yet he said that he and his comrades cannot change the economic environment within which these policies are to be implemented.
...
Oh my, I thought. When the people in charge come to think of health care reform as the easy part of their job, the nation certainly is in deep trouble. But the conversation also highlighted the psychological burden being shouldered by Obama and his aides. They are striving mightily to stave off total economic collapse, and they have no idea if their policies will work. In their free and private moments, do they quietly (and justifiably) freak out? I had the impression that this fellow does. But thankfully, he and his colleagues have diversions--such as fixing the health care system."
Interesting take, I'm sure they need this diversion...anything for relief.
Mother Jones had something to say about healthcare authored by David Corn: White House Freak Out?
Gibberish.
Posted by phidipidese at March 6, 2009 09:07 AM