Well, ok, but then the ad will be plastered all over all the TV and newspapers for however many news cycles this lasts, and a bunch of people will come away convinced that the AARP hates our troops and loves gay people.

Beautiful. What are you, the new Democratic Rove? It's a great strategy, and, frankly, it's not rocket science (though you expound with great coherance).

Yes, Yes, a thousand times yes.

Why "shoot your load" all in one day? Drag it out over a couple of days....maximize coverage over several news cycles so it doesn't go away after 1 day.

furryjester--I wouldn't mind if this ad is run in the lower corner of all networks for a month....seniors identify strongly with the AARP. It has a very positive connotation with them. It is part of their identity--this ad won't change that. If they see someone trying to discredit their very identity, they will be apoplectic! They will remember, they vote.

Well, I like the entire agenda. The slime attacks SHOULD give the Democrats a perfect opening for attack. But I'm not sanguine about them all jumping in with both combat boots in a timely fashion, considering that that our "leadership" in Congress seems to be sitting timidly by while they see if the "liberal" corporate media give them cover to attack Guckert/Gannon since he seems sullied by GASP! sex issues. Please Howard, make me proud!

Another problem with your ideal scenario is that Novelli is a corporate insurance whore who wrote a glowing and enthusiastic forward to his best buddy, Newt Gingrich's last book. When he endorsed the Bush prescription scam, I demanded and received, a refund on my AARP membership.

Perhaps their eyes have been opened by the sheer sleaziness of the attack. We can only hope.

That would be playing right into their hand. Look, this idiotic little two-bit photoshop concoction was up on a few rightwing websites for a minute-and-a-half. You're effectively suggesting that we flood the cable news shows and the sunday morning talkfests with the "story." This is what people wil hear: outrage, outrage, outrage, AARP hates the army and loves gays, more outrage. Plus some Heritage goon will get some more free airtime to talk about why 'personal accounts' are good (while dodging the Outragers questions).

It's not perfect, but I really think one is better off ignoring it.

The AARP is beloved by millions of seniors across the country and in practically all political parties. We HAVE to make these wingnuts pay for this!

Great idea.

(furryjester has a point in that slime is toxic no matter how you react -- ignore and you surrender, react and you magnify it -- but I think s/he's definitely wrong on this one, because it targets a powerful third party.)

BUT ... I won't hold my breath. The ITB accommodationists, ever sensitive to next quarter's political consultancy billings, will urge caution ... caution ...

DFA has a petition up [ http://bsd.democracyforamerica.com/page/petition/stopusanext ] - already... I got the email notice less than an hour ago.
Seems like pretty good 'rapid response'.

> Dean can then also say that the DNC will be
> watching to see if the RNC does in fact repudiate
> this ad and smear, and if the RNC does not do so,
> the DNC will assume that the RNC plans to engage
> in the worst kind of politics to support the
> privatization of Social Security.

Thus making it impossible for the DNC to repudiate anything that any "liberal" 527 says/does for the next 10 years, no matter how odious or damaging to Democratic candidates.

Cranky

i wonder whether the ad was pulled because of a copyright violation. yesterday, a kos poster emailed the portland paper that owns the photo of the wedding couple, notifying them of the pic's use in the USAN ad.

Sounds like a plan. This should be sent to all the Dems mentioned. Don't wait. This an oppertunity that shouldn't be wasted.

Interesting ideas all. My one question is: Do our beltway leaders, especally Sen. Lieberman and other so called moderates read the blogs at all or do they work without one ear to the ground?

FIRST
Novelli should explain why AARP signed on to the Medicare bill AND does he still believe the White House cost numbers.

The revised cost for the prescription plan being 1.2 trillion.

Dancing with the Devil gets you burned. USAN is holding the blow torch.

AARP will spend years (re)convincing seniors they have their interest at heart.

I'd like to see if Grover (the Grinch) Norquist is involved with this. I have to imagine he's got his grubby litle fingers in on this somehow.

Norquist's
missive
on how the greatest generation are anti-american because they supported social security is revealing, this is what the Republican party really believes. They are incredibly out of touch with what matters to working people. I mean look at what Norquist said:

"Each year, 2 million people who fought in the Second World War and lived through the Great Depression die. This generation has been an exeception in American history, because it has defended anti-American policies.  They voted for the creation of the welfare state and obligatory military service. They are the base of the Democratic Party. And they are dying. And, at the same time, all the time more Americans have stocks. That makes them defend the interests of business, because it is their own interest. Because of that, it's impossible to bring to the fore policies of social hate, of class warfare."

Only problem I see with this is what if they're smart and they do denounce the ad? I don't see why they wouldn't. They certainly don't want to piss off seniors since they actually vote, and it doesn't seem like they want to appear associated with a group of loonies like USAN. I'm not convinced that they'll all refuse to repudiate the ad. If they do, though, your plan rocks!

Second thoughts. Why not have Dean and the Democrats lead. That leaves AARP unsullied, allows them to focus on their agenda, and keeps the ad id away from them. Dean and the Democrats come out as hard fighters defending the elderly and retired from this slime.

I like it!

I'd add one thing: Dean (or Reid or Pelosi) should pointedly remind the GOP (and the press) of some of the times the GOP or its fellow travelers have demanded the Dems repudiate someone to their left over comparatively innocuous stuff, to drive home the point that they're hypocrites if they don't repudiate this nonsense.

This is the only way to counter stuff like this. In Maryland a Republican slimester was spreading rumors that Martin O' Mally (D, Mayor of Baltimore, probably next Gov of MD) was having an affair. Rather than ignore it O'Mally went on the offensive and held a pressconference. The Republican slimester resigned, the Republican Gov of MD looks like an asshole and O'Mally looks like someone who will protect his family.

A good strategy in general, but the AARP press event should be led by several octgenarians who will talk about their families, how proud they are of their grandchildren in the military, and how they are SHOCKED, absolutely SHOCKED by the things in this ad!

Steve,
you live in a fantacy world! you think the DEMS will fight back? You make me laugh!

The fact that they took the photo off the website is meaningless. Did you read the "articles"? They are still asserting that AARP promotes gay marriage, is out of step with Americans, manipulated poll data, and generally is the devil incarnate. They also persist in saying expressly that they will use "Swifties" tactics againt AARP. I can't believe AARP would be placated at all.
These USA Next people are scum of the first order, but that's how we like them here, vis., the Chimperor George Warmonger Bu$h.

The AARP has learned what should be an important lesson for all-especially Joe Lieberman: being friendly with this White House (the Medicare Bill) is like befriending a rattlesnake-sooner or later it will bite you!

And who's gonna care ??

The only people that eat this crap up don't care about anyone being accountable. Don't you get it, people are looking for a reason to hate, not unite. You act like this is actually changing people's mind, it's not, it's enforcing everything Bush.

I am so tired of people acting like these strategies are doing exactly what it is suppose to. There is no defense, get it ???

I hate Rove, but he is a genius, and judging by your 'action plan' it's pretty obvious he played you like he plays everyone else.

Isn't that Ken Mehlman with the earring? Why not just let him have his moment?

Hahahaha! Let's all just imagine for moment a Dem Party in which the DLC-corrupted, boot-licking mucky-mucks ACTUALLY WERE CAPABLE of thinking and doing things like this! Hahhahaha! You slay me. But maybe they WILL apologize for something some Democrat might have thought this week. And hope Rove forgives them for being so rude.

Great suggestions. Let's hope the Dems do it.

ScottW,
I agree totally. Steve - this is a stupid response.
The response should be hireing a group who will start spreading rumors like karl rove is a pedephile. I'm serious. This is where our mass media is at. Slim attacks like AARP are gay lovers, etc. So start calling the twins lesbians. Its the only way to fight back effectively.

Be careful to not take AARP too serious. Bill Novelli is a close friend of Newt Gingerich and wrote the forward to one of the Newsters books. AARP caught hell for Medicare SCAM but don't assume their position on Social Security is in line with the opposition. Kabuki Theater is all about not knowing who or what the actors are pretending to be until the end?

Excellent suggestions, however, the eunich democrats simply don't have the cojones. Period.

Great idea. That is IF we had a media who would actually report it.

It will never even get a mention on Faux News. CNN is becoming more right wing every day. One of the big 3 might touch it, but only in passing due to time constraints. It might get a minute or two on Keith Olbermans show, and a segment on the Friday night talking head shows.

Sadly I think this will just be another in the long list of Republican outrages that is covered everywhere on the Net, but fails to penetrate the 'self' censorship of the mainstream media.

right on... right on!

Anything that divides America helps the other side, not us. That is their overarching and ultimately victorious genius.

With the corporate takeover of the media, we now have zero chance of a fair fight. Their do fear the blogs. That is why they will find a way to crush the blogs. Wait and see.

In other words, they've won and we've lost. Pack it in and look to the future, not the past. Our only solace will come in hastening the collapse of the temple on all our heads.

America is over, its best days long gone. Do not pine for them; they will never return as we knew them.

It doesn't really matter, because in fifty years we're a province of China anyway no matter who wins our meaningless banana republic "elections."

Steve Soto is dead right--fight back with everything you have.

If we cannot defend social security we have no business being a party, and the American people will know it.

I attended Rick Santorum's SS dog and pony show yesterday in Pittsburgh,and, along with appreciating againg what is an incompetent but evil liar he is, one thing that was clear to me was that Bushco's SS strategy is to appeal to the young voter by styling the elderly at least as threats to the 18-25 year-old, if not as flat out enemies. Rick said such things as (approximately): It's not a problem for those who retire now but it's a problem for the young. Too few workers supporting too many old people. Is it fair to take this young person's money and only give him a small percent back so we can continue SS.?" There was good response from the brownshirted undergrads in the audience. (By the way, there was plenty of opposition there, too.)
So yes, ScottW lots of our fellow citizens are looking for people to hate, and Bu$hco is providing the fodder. In the meantime, they peel off people from the young demographic and they'll probably actually peel off some of the "greatest generation", because every generation includes its haters.

The basic idea sounds good, but it doesn't look like the Democrats in office have the stomach for a fight.

The idea that any response just helps USAN by giving airtime sounds wrong. Vicious little memes like the one in the ad get picked up by other right-wing outlets, they bleed into the MSM, thanks to Coulter-booking producers, and in a few weeks or months it's all too normal to bother objecting to, and a fourth of the country believes it.

Declining to respond is a dubious strategy. The better approach seems to be to make the mainstream right feel pain when they dance with the fringe, or to drive a wedge between the mainstream and the fringe -- thus marginalizing the fringe right (as the fringe left is marginalized).

It is worth noting that the fringe right seems to be driving the Republican party. How does it happen that Ann Coulter and other purveyors of right-wing hate speech get booked on MSM shows? Part of the answer has to be that Democrats don't know how to hit them with their own words. Democrats don't know how to Ward-Churchillize people.

I'm all for fighting fair, but that doesn't mean being nice or surrendering. There's a fair way to slash throats -- you just do it to the deserving, and you do it with legitimate criticism rather than lies and sleaze. The right has spewed plenty of acid that could be flung back at them fairly, honestly, legitimately. But we need leaders who don't faint at the sight of blood.

(Please note that I'm calling for rhetorical, not physical, blood and violence. I am not Michael Savage.)

the swiftness with which this "ad" was pulled down is curious. Was it simply intended as a warning shot to AARP management? Seems like the message could have been relayed better. Or does Rove just think he can get away with anything? Or do they have so many wackos working for them that they've just lost control of them. Under any of the above, it sure helped get Gannongate off the blogs for a day or two. Something about Gannongate scared someone bigtime, methinks.

Dean should also call on RNC head Ken Mehlman to admit that he himself, Ken Mehlman, is in fact gay.

Lot's of good stuff here...trying to use their tactics and frame the debate before it is framed for us.
For those who caution and think ignoring this is the way to go, isn't that just what Kerry thought would work when he was attacked by this same group? And, we all saw just how successful that approach worked...not.

Yo, dawgs, we gotta do a ad that shows Bush doin' a bukake all over his mother's face, man! That'll freak'em out big time.

Steve, this would be a foolish strategy, as it promotes their plan ("they" being the Republicans, of course). What they want to do is to force the press to counter every statement made by the "liberal AARP" with a statement made by the "conservative USANext", even though the AARP has millions of dues paying members and USANext has none. AARP is going to want to maintain their status as an organization that serves the interests of seniors but that otherwise does not take sides.

Yes, this stuff needs to be stomped on and nipped in the bud. But it needs to be done in a way that doesn't make the AARP appear to be joined at the hip to Democrats. The AARP can point out that it backed Bush's Medicare "reform" plan (a stupid move, in my opinion), and it can demand a retraction. But it can't look like Democrats are driving the AARP (so it might even serve the cause if the Dems take a shot or two at the AARP from the left, at least for bad judgment on Medicare).

Of course Steve is absolutely right. And of course, AARP and the Dems are going to let Rove, the Swifties and Art Linkletter get away with it scott free, just like John Kerry and Bob Shrum did.

Absolutely right, Steve! I have always said that every time Democrats see something like this they should ask themselves what would Delay, Gingrich, etc. do with a similar situation? After figuring their response INCREASE BY A FACTOR OF 10 AND IT SHOULD BE THE CORRECT AMOUNT.

We should first leave this one to the comics. And then have AARP put it in their newsletter to all their members.

So the "ad" gets national media exposure, and the right-wingers get complete deniability by saying that "It was the action of a rogue staffer who has been disciplined. And besides, we took down the ad two minutes after it was first put up."

They come off looking sensible, while the red-in-the-face liberals simply amplify the stereotype of "wingnut" that's already floating over our heads.

At best you'll get a few repubs on camera saying "We think the ad is terrible, but it has nothing to do with the Republican Party." At worst, you'll have seniors around the country wondering if the AARP is actually promoting some sort of terrible agenda.

It's a lose-lose situation. Better to have let it die, although I'm sure it's too late for that now.

Hint: They're using your outrage to destroy you. You cannot win the fights they pick. You have to pick your own fights, and make sure they're ones you can win.

-

And of course that plan will never come close to happening. Our party is simply not that coordinated and not that disciplined. Nothing will come of that fucking ad. Nothing.

We have so far to go before we "get it."

It's interesting how only the GOP is the ignorant knuckle draggers ruining society. It may make you feel good to feel as the victim in all cases GOP, but it is not helping you to win elections....your party grows insignificant because you refuse to find common ground. Go ahead, alienate another % of the population with your childish insults. It is not fixing the problem...if you think things are bad now, wait till there is only one party. Where is the Dem who will reach out to America?

From your pen to God's ear, Steve. Your game plan is right on. Somehow I have the sinking feeling that Novelli, Reid and Pelosi won't join in because they just aren't ready to play hardball yet. Don't know what the hell they are waiting for. Hope I'm wrong.

I agree with Jon and the others who have counseled us to save our ammunition.

The reason USA Next posted the entire New York Times article about the situation on their site is to crow about having received that free publicity.

In any event, Karl Rove hasn't been elected to any office, and, despite "Bush's Brain", his role is not well known by the general populace.

The only Republicans who might be held to account for stunts like this one are the incumbent Republican congressmen who may find themselves in competitive districts. They might be forced to disavow the attacks, but only if some sort of organization takes place in those districts, generating some volume of complaints.

yeah, baby!!!

Hasn't the AARP been practically fellating shrub for 4 years? I seriously doubt they'll get on board any project that aims to embarass or defame him. Most older people, fools they may be, support this fascist theocrat.

your party grows insignificant because you refuse to find common ground.

wow, joe lieberman is on this board. go fuck yourself, senator!

Look, this idiotic little two-bit photoshop concoction was up on a few rightwing websites for a minute-and-a-half. You're effectively suggesting that we flood the cable news shows and the sunday morning talkfests with the "story."

Correct.

How much mileage did the GOP get out of MoveOn.org and the "Hitler" ad contest entry?

I like your ideas, but would add that the AARP should assemble a group of 25 (or whatever number works for TV) men and women who are active AARP members AND retired military, and get them to appear wearing their military dress uniforms, then publically ask why the White House is sanctioning this ad that "insults our veterans."

Everything but the gay prostitute comment. Don't mention Gannon, we're above that. And drag it out over one week.

The only way it'll happen is if we call or email Dean and the others to speak up and use this as ammunition. Ammunition I say, for we are at war! Give Dean ammo!

God bless Steve. These dirt bags know no bounds. I really hope this was the campaign that went too far. Keep the heat on

Let’s let them have it with both barrels and make the USAN toxic for the Republicans.

All I can say is hot diggity damn! It's more fun being a liberal these days then before, when it was all "let's figure out what the Republicans are doing, agree with them, and then propose a slightly less radical policy."

I personally can't stand anything about the AARP. Bunch of old people who didn't save enough money during their productive years in America's economic heydey who now want me and my family to fork over more taxes from our already overextended budget to give them an ever-increasing amount of prescriptions, surgeries, and whatever the hell else they whine about, so they can live to 89 years thanks to medical science instead of 85 years like God intended. The only free stuff I want to give them are cartons of Marlboros and cases of Bourbon. Go Away you AARP leeches, and get your hands off my wallet. That said, the ad is offending. I'll give you that.

They pulled it from their front page, but the ad still resides on their server, along with the other ads that this group will be running soon (somebody grab these before they are moved):

Original ad:
http://www.spectator.org/_ads/2.gif

Banner ad:
http://www.spectator.org/_ads/3.gif

Long vertical ad:
http://www.spectator.org/_ads/6.gif

And that's exactly what they hope will happen. Kerrey did the same thing with the Swift Boat ads and it became a "gotta present both sides" moral equivalency in the media. I can see it now: Howard Fineman weighing in "IS AARP really a front for the gay left? While AARP denies this, USANext presents their case that AARP's so-called senior agenda is merely a smokescreen for anit-military, pro-gay activists......"

That's why it's so offensive and so utterly untied to the Social Security debate. It's not about the issues, it's not about AARP -- it's about getting the media to talk about it and getting their talking cretins on the cable news shoutfests.

The Next Smear
Signalled by the selection of Highstakes Bill Bennett to front USANEXT

Six weeks ago, the noise machine went after AARP magazine editor Ed Dwyer, over his employment 30 years ago at High Times Magazine.

This followed a press release from AARP on the results of a poll of older Americans on their attitudes regarding the laws prohibiting use of marijuana as medecine. The poll showed 72% support.

from  Conservative Truth  From Pot To Porn To AARP - by Cliff Kincaid

It hired an admitted former drug user and dealer as an editor of its 22-million circulation magazine. He has emerged as a spokesman on the so-called "medical marijuana" issue, telling America that seniors might benefit from smoking dope.

AARP confirmed AARP magazine editor Ed Dwyer's curious background, saying that he wrote for High Times magazine and Playboy but had also done work for "quality" publications...

 With the assistance of Jeanette McDougal of Drug Watch International, anti-drug activists Joyce Nalepka and Dee Rathbone uncovered the Dwyer connection when they read how AARP had "decided to study" the issue of "medical marijuana."...

 ...we had to wonder how many grandparents who participated in this AARP poll were aware what they were voting to support. We suspect very few have any idea. Grandparents are the most anti-drug segment of our society."

 Perhaps this is why seniors have been targeted with a poll that is being used to push dope.

From TIME Magazine Sep. 08, 1975

However, hip-casual Editor Ed Dwyer, 27, formerly with Coronet, draws a careful distinction. Says he: "We support the legalization of marijuana, but we never advocate the use of it. We report on its use and the interesting facts associated with altering consciousness, but we do not lead our readers into drugs. Everybody must decide by himself. It's a personal thing."

wow! That is some strategy! I'm for it. I'd love to see such smart proactive stuff from our guys. Rove and Delay have got to be taught that they are not the only ones who know how to go for the jugular.

Hats off to you, Steve Soto.

fwiw: the dscc has hired Tom Daschle's campaign manager to head up the SS fight.

fwiw: the dscc has hired Tom Daschle's campaign manager to head up the SS fight.

File under "Some People Never Learn." Or under "Shrum, Bob."

The AARP is corrupt. A lobbyist group funded by tax dollars that lobbies for higher taxes. They serve no purpose. The part about fighting for rights of "the elderly" is a crock. Washington needs to be rid of all lobbyists and their influence peddling, scare tactics, backdoor deals, and money grubbing. There's no better place to start than by getting rid of AARP, or at least cutting off the taxpayer subsidy. sheesh.

I think that having it "plastered all over all the TV and newspapers for however many news cycles this lasts" and to "shoot [the proverbial] load all in one day" are both central elements to this elegant strategy.

If everything alleged here is correct (and I am disinclined to believe otherwise) a well-organized backlash from the AARP will clarify any and all ambiguity in the USANext campaign(s) and denude them of any residual credibility.

The American people--even folks from red states--are beginning to recognize the pattern of wanton mendacity that informs and defines this administration and its allies.

Now that the election is over, popular conservative thought has evolved from merely opposing the reality-based community at all costs, to a more nuanced philosophy:

"Praise the Lord, support the troops, fight the terror, etc... But mess not with our money and our medicine!"

This is bona fide rationality at long last rearing its nettlesome head. All that is required now is a bit more proof and a tipping point will be attained.

fwiw: the dscc has hired Tom Daschle's campaign manager to head up the SS fight.

File under "Some People Never Learn." Or under "Shrum, Bob."

Posted by Dave J. at February 22, 2005 04:11 PM

I don't know: there were an awful lot of factors (some insurmountable) in that campaign.
Let's give it some time.

If someone prints an untruth about you, you demand a retraction at the very least. If you do not challenge it, then people have every right to think that you agree with it.

At the minimum the AARP and allies need to challenge the assertions made and demand an apology. As they are doing this, they need to ask what progress is being made to insure that SS will protect the disabled(veterans) and elderly after they can no longer work. Is this not the work of a compassionate society?

Brilliant strategy! When will it start to unfold?

You know what my only problem with all of this is? Well, I'll tell you. If the AARP supports gay marriage rights, it shouldn't be cowed into backing away from that. It is, after all the morally right point of view to have. And, yeah, I know what Rove and cronies are trying to do, but you can't give them an inch in the long run. We have to win the social security debate, but we can't let them paint people who are pro-equal marriage rights as whacko extremists.

It HAS to be challenged, because if the perpetrators are not made EXTREMELY uncomfortable, THEY'LL KEEP DOING IT.

I'm not holding my breath re. any kind of coordinated, intense challenge -- the Democrats are marginally braver these days, but it's not enough (why???)

What does gay marriage have to do with AARP?

That's why this should be blasted all over the place. Does that argument make the least bit of sense? Retired People, Association for the Advancement of. Get it?

It's the most absurd and patently illogical argument these slimeballs have come up with to date. So put the fascists on the defensive. Get them to answer the questions, say yes, we reject these ads, or hell no, we love these slime bags.

It really doesn't matter what they say, they're responding to us.

If Kerry learned anything from the campaign, it was that people do take these smears AND fighting back seriously.

If the Dems intend to turn over a new leaf in the tactical assualt project, then this is a perfect place to start.

Challenge early, challenge clearly, and be vigilant.

And bloggers need to do their part to light a fire under reluctant pugilists.

Great ideas - how does one convey this suggestion to the approiate people?

Makes a lot of sense.

Which is why the Democrats will never do it.

I'm with ScottW. I fear that the Hater constituency is too big to be marginalized, and attempts at shaming their near-cousins to repudiate them will be largely ineffective.

Fight slime with slime. Target powerful right wing lobbying groups (the NRA is probably untouchable, but maybe the various Chambers of Commerce have potential). Accuse them of every heresy and perversion imaginable. "They want to legalize fetus eating at church picnics!" And one glorious day the Haters will be in our tent, and our own Coulters will preach the gospel of bile. And they will be ours, and we will own their words and actions, and we will win elections. And maybe we'll get a step closer to single-payer health care and slightly more progressive taxation.

Oh, beautiful for spacious skies...

CNN's "Inside Politics" did carry a short piece with the slimey graphics, but it was more like a teaser for tomorrow's show - which will have Jarvis as a guest.

Ding, Ding

Round one has started, Dems! Time to get in the ring or be pussified yet again and lose.

Ah, bullshit. I'm technically a "senior" in AARP Marketing's eyes (51) and the statement "seniors identify strongly with the AARP. It has a very positive connotation with them" is a pure crock for me, and sounds like it was written by a 25-year old. "Seniors" are not all in the same lump, chump. Somebody 51 is absolutely not the same as someone who's made it to 91. Know with whom you're dealing.

Forgot I wanted to say this. Democrats should start the campaign with a page out of Art Linkletter's playbook as he is a spokesman for republican group USAN that is sponsoring the smear campaign.

Republicans say the Darndest Things!

For those too young to remember Linkletter's tv show (and claim to fame I think)it was called "Kids say the Darndest Things". That should be the name of the Democrats Campaign.

Absolutely brilliant. And for that very reason the !@$%%^^ Democrats will not do it!

I don't get it. What's so sickening about two guys kissing?

to show this add in a press conference to denounce them, you will just give them free publicity.

just ignore it and focus ALL of your energies on YOUR message, notto rebut theirs.

Gannon should stick, there needs to be more and more efort put on the connections, the invitations to the white house parties, and previous efforts to influence the Daschel race.

teh public WANTS to believe a very hi up person in the whitehouse is porking a gay male prostitute for personal favors with national policy implications.

They do not WANT to believe that all republicans think old people are anti-society. your message will backfire as it is doubtful you will be able to put a human face high enough in the whitehouse in a positio taht will capture the publics attention in this day of reality TV.

I conclusion, focus on your message, not theirs!

Look at who Novelli is before making suggestions about what he can do.

Novelli is a former Republican PR hack. Since taking over AARP, he has change the structure so members have absolutly no power. Plus he was instrumental in AARP's embracing Bush's Medicare scam. Don't count on Novelli for anything.

I read this post yesterday. I see it's linked to by three other great blogs today, so I read it again to see if it was the same one.

Steve, I love you, but (uh oh, a but coming...) this advice of yours sucks to all blue hell. This achieves the goals of the GOP very nicely.

The GOP goal is not to destroy AARP. The goal is to MARGINALIZE it in the short term by tainting its image as a grasroots organization for elders and turning it into just another left-wing organization. And, of course, if you have your choice between a right-wing truth or a left-wing truth, well, the choice is obvious, right? At least it's obvious to the faithful right-wingers who might be confused by a non-partisan group like AARP opposing their fearless leader.

So, they attack AARP. We defend AARP. AARP fights back by challenging Bush in coordination with Howard Dean. That is your suggestion. Dude, that's total victory for the Right.

A better way to fight back is to have some little gremlins (they know who they are, those gremlins) start a left-wing anti-AARP and anti-Bush, demanding fair and equal time whenever some blowhard like Bill Bennett goes on TV. And when Bennett attacks AARP, our little gremlin-guy should agree that AARP sucks but say that the problem is that they CAVED IN TO BUSH ON THE PRESCRIPTION DRUG BILL. God knows, I would love somebody to point out the delicious irony of that.

The result of all this: there are then THREE sides to the media debate. The right, the left, and AARP. It's just like chess dude. They push their king pawn forward two squares and we push forward ours.

Dumbo may make some sense, but... he is an elephant.

You're falling right into the trap. The Swift Boaters ran a small campaign but it was MAGNIFIED by the indignation of Democrats and covered en masse by the press. That's how most people, including myself, got exposed to the Swift Boat stuff. The more you dignify stuff like this in a public way, the more their message gets through. Granted many will be turned off, but some will actually be persuaded; just as they were by the Swift Boaters.

bcg, yeah that sure worked for Kerry, didn't it?

I am appalled by the reaction to this retarded concept. Liberalism is dead by your hands you filthy war-criminals! It isn't right when Karl Rove pulls this politiking shit, and it remains completely ananthema to anything resembling proper human behavior when it spews out of Howard Dean's mouth. The problems aren't going to be solved in the long term if you don't quit letting them set the moral agenda both in the political arena and the tactical arena. It's just plain wrong and you know it. Are we here to play games? Or are we here to make sound idealogical arguments against privatization? Maybe, just fucking maybe, the reason you pathetic sellouts always lose is because you have no ideology anymore. The republicans have sucked your souls dry and you are shells of human beings, relegated to petty bickering instead of fighting for people and their rights as individuals. So, while you play politics and feel all happy that you can attack them in the most, and I say that emphatically, THE MOST superficial way possible, I'll get back to trying to create some real change.

The Democratics don't have the balls to go up against Rove. They don't have guts enough to jump into the gutter with him and shove his own crap into his pig jaws.

You have to take it a step further. After the repudiation process, a listing is made on multiple websites, networks, and major newspapers of all the companies who have provided support for this RNC front, and then a listing of specific, frontline products and time frames to boycott as a direct response from AARP members and concerned citizens.

Otherwise, history has shown they have no concern about the verbal 'wrist slap' responses. (they got all they wanted out of the Swift Boat ads with no consequence) There must be real live consequence for the action that translates in dollars.

I like the proposed plan of response; however, I think the Dems are simply not organized to respond with the unity and quickness needed to execute it as designed. And that is a great pity. I am at the age where AARP sends regular solicitations to join and I have not responded mainly because of the recent positions they have taken; they are ,at the core, an insurance company with lots of fringe benefits that have corporate ties---that is how it always seemed when my late father used their "services". I agree with the sentiment that AARP needs to make peace with the folks who opposed the prescription drug issue before lending a big helping hand to AARP despite how attractive that might seem.

It's brilliant, but it won't happen. The Democrats are too disunited, too weak, too humanistic, too hesitant. They haven't learned--even now--any lessons from the Republicans. Strike hard, strike fast, strike mean, and speak with one voice. Until they do this, the country will continue to slide further into one-party rule and the Democrats will become more and more inconsequential. If Biden could have a love fest with Gonzales at his hearing, then the cause of giving them a spine seems almost hopeless.

Well, wouldn't it be nice. What you propose is that the AARP and Dems should act like an effective, coordinated political bloc. Kinda like the GOP and its Mighty Wurlitzer, to state the obvious. We should for once act in concert and put the GOP on the defensive and keep them there. They're wide open and this is a perfect opportunity.

Meanwhile Lieberman is getting ready to provide the GOP all the cover they need on this issue. Look for the Lieberman-Graham "compromise" coming soon to a theater of political self-defeat near you. Won't work to preserve the program, but it will prevent anyone from focusing on what the bananaRepubicans are really up to. Plus Holy Joe will feel endless waves of deeply gratifying self-congratulation and nobility for his willingness to treat the other side like they were actually sincere human beings and not the ideology-driven fanatics they have turned themselves into over the last decade or so.

But your plan is a good one. Sigh.

So bottom line, you want the Dems to fight back and say that the AARP is actually pro-war and anti-gay marriage?

Brilliant.

In my opinion, the solution to this entire issue is developing a coherent communications machine that pumps out OUR version of reality. Sadly, most people think and respond to issues in simple, non-abstract terms. It's too difficult for them any other way... especially since the information they receive is so dumbed down. We need to develop simple, compelling messages and spread them via viral marketing campaigns. We need to stage newsworthy "events" such as boycotts targeting the neocon's corporate supporters and advertisers. Anything to grab the public's eye for a few seconds, so they will consider a different view of reality and rather than blindly accept the neocon version.

Anyone who has read the book or seen the video named "Bush's Brain"would have some knowledge of how Carl Rove operates.He always remains beneath the radar screen.In 1986 did he put an electronic device in his own office to help Bill Clements become governor of Texas?Was he responsible for the false documents that caused problems for CBS and Dave Rather and got people's attention off the real issues? He should be getting much more attention.Maybe the bloggers will do it.

Maybe swomebody already mentioned this but AARP should point out that the Administration played footsies with AARP on Medicare and just quote a lot of the nice things Administration officials had to say about AARP back then.

I have heard (and suspected) that Karl Rove is a gay man of the self-hating (remember his glossy reminiscence of first meeting Dubya: "I can literally remember what he was wearing: an Air National Guard flight jacket, cowboy boots . . . . He was exuding more charisma than any one individual should be allowed to have.") J Edgar Hoover/Roy Cohn variety who delights in demonizing gays while scaring the faithful into voting for and supporting Bush's agenda. After all, he's carved out his little ass-kissing back-stabbing niche, doing the dirty work for dubya while dubya struts and smirks, all smiles and charm and innocence - so who cares who suffers in the process. Not Rove. Not dubbie.

So perhaps the Dems should point a finger back at Mr. Rove and highlight a smidgen of the monumental hypocrisy (in all areas) of this administration, tho I am doubtful that for those worshiping at the altar of Bush, it would do much to mitigate their adulation. But the gay wedge issue (so to speak) aside, why aren't the tables being turned on the Bushies with as much vengeance and vitriol as they turn them on us? Those people stop at nothing to grab power and wealth (same difference). The Dems need to get nasty, then nastier.

Doesn't the soldier look a lot like W? Funny, other than his Mission Accomplished appearance,
it's hard to find photos of him in uniform...

I have heard (and suspected) that Karl Rove is a gay man of the self-hating

Yes. I suspect he's a bottom. And he likes 8"-cut men.

102 comments! it's like freakin eschaton here!

Don't like the idea at all. Hooking AARP with the Dems is a big mistake. First, AARP won't do it since they rolled over on the Medicare prescription plan to the detriment of most seniors and to the benefit of "W" and his drug company pals.
Then bringing Dean into it while he still hasn't proven whether he is a kook driving the Dems to certain suicide or not. As to Pelosi and Reid, we know she has no cajones biologically but also philosopically as well and Reid is a bigger coward than she is.
Now as a Republican myself, I would use Roves own tactics against him. First I would "alter the ad" a bit, by making the soldier a younger version of Kerry. Then I would make the two guys smooching be Karl Rove and "W". Then I would distribute them as flyers with RNC as the distributor and send them to as many senior citizens as possible. After all, one dirty trick deserves another.
But after reading some of the comments here, I see than too many Dems beileve that if they play fair then people will come to them.... well I wouldn't hold my breath. After all, if a Rick Santorum can be elected Senator, an Arnold can be elected Governor using the same lies that "W" used to become President and a Thune can displace Daschle in a state like South Dakota where people are pretty intelligent and straightforward then I guess the Dems had better hunker down for 20-30 years before they become a major party again. Why? Simply because the Repubs are winning the "hearts and minds" of the college students right now, the same group that empowered Kennedy, Johnson, Carter and Clinton. If you don't believe so then check out the local college and see how far to the right it has swung in the past 10 years. Or look at Santorum's "town hall" meeting and see who supported his twisted ideas on SS. So while you are enjoying your principled approach, the Tammany Hall methods of the current neo-cons will lock them into office until my Grandkids retire... or are placed on iceburgs and floated out to sea, a more likely end with the mentality now governing our country. Sorry, I don't buy into that. When it is the future of my family that is at stake I leave my principles behind and bring out the brass knuckles.

Wait, so you're saying that this non-profit, tax-exempt organization is actually a political arm of the Democratic Party?

You are perhaps the only person ignorant enough to take your half-baked advice seriously.

by answering an attack originating from the right youre forced to show your cards, which you can't because the more the naked truth about your statism is shown the more WE will turn on you. You have to change the question or answer another you pick out of the air. You simply can't answer a direct challenge from freedom loving open minded individuals. Stupidity and ignorance cannot explain your losses. Something happened and you missed it. You have lost in DC and now youre losing in the ME and soon in Europe. Youre in a fish trap, keep wriggling and fighting it so that you get stuck deeper. SS is a transfer payment vote buying crime against your children but youre too smart to see that arent you. The fucking Slovak Republic is light years ahead of you in terms of freedom and empowerment and all you can think of is sucking another guys dick... Youre pathetic and it saddens me that there's no Democratic counterbalance to the current majority party, just shrill reactive dependants running in little circles. Its not Rove or Bush or any of that shit, you morons, its YOUR PARTY fucking up so bad that you can't even get your own socialists to vote for you. Whatever, as they say in Cali, I don't care and neither do you. Youre not talking about politics or the people, youre still talking about yourself, again.

Must one study for a long time to bloviate with such total and complete stupidity?

Get a grip, guys. The majority of the franchise doesn't agree with you. In a democracy that means you're wrong. Why don't you try to come up with ideas that energize the franchise in your favor? Oh, I know: That'd require being an adult, leaving behind your eternal adolescence, right? Bummer, dude!

I find it interesting that attacking the RNC or GOP is recommended so heavily and heartily by Mr. Soto.

Mr. Soto seems to think that all Republicans or all conservatives have some sort of hatred for others who don't think like "they" do. This, simply put, is wrong at best, defamatory at worst.

Example... I am a conservative. I have no beliefs about AARP regarding their positions toward gays whatsoever. I do have a particular beef with AARP because of their position on gun control.

Disagreement on policy or positions does not make a person a reprehensible pos-son, as some would like to make you think. It simply means that not all people agree.

As far as being able to stir up something on this issue, someone needs to get a life. Keeping the country sharply divided will only help the enemies of this country - it cannot and will not help the country become better.

The only benefit such negative attacks yields is that it shows how radical and wrong the left really is, and how readily they will sacrifice their own country for the sake of their "PARTY".

Now that, friends, is reprehensible.

Spikie

It is telling that all these self identified conservatives, and even the ones who won't admit it and you have to read between their lines on, advise NOT to fight back. That sure worked well for president Kerry.

Re: "AARP Chief Exec Bill Novelli needs to call Karl Rove and demand that the White House condemn the ad and the tactics of the USAN."

Your logic is unassailable. Using the same logic, I would like you to send me $100 to show that you do not beat orphans and widows. "...Failure to do this will be interpreted by [me] as a sign that [you] support and partner in this.."

Its always nice when a member of the moonbat left comes out of hiding. Get your own house in order and maybe people to the right of Lenin will pay attention to you. Looks like your hysterical rantings are the printed equivilant of the foam contractors spray into the spaces between walls. Harmless if left alone, but gives you the runs if you touch it. PJ-wearers like you are why the middle of the road will never warm up to your party even if they were being cremated together.

Thad, it’s always illuminating to see the alternate universe that guys like you live in. Sure, we’ve lost in the ME and Europe; that’s why they all love Bush and his agenda so much. Oh, wait....

YETMO, who in the hell is your comment directed at? The country agrees with Democrats on Social Security. Or has that escaped you as well?

Spikie, you complain about people who spend their time keeping the country divided. If that is your overriding concern, then what do you have to say about Karl Rove and George W. Bush, and what exactly has the Democratic Party gained from trying to work this cabal the last four years? Or are you in favor of unilateral disarmament only when it applies to Democrats?

Jim, it’s a simple request that Rove can deal with simply. He won’t, because he engineered the whole thing.

And John King, who exactly is your comment directed at? By the way, your attempt at cleverness needs more work. Again, you seem to have no problem with the “hysterical rantings” coming from the right wing blogosphere or the GOP cabal in power, but for the left to put forward a suggestion for an aggressive pushback generates a comment from you about cremation, Lenin, and PJ wearers. Can you guys get better writers and talking points than that?

hey steve it must by really hard to cherry pick comments about others. you must be a real captain of industry to be able to run this blog, regurgitate what others put time and thought into, run them down AND find the time to pump gas. wow it almost makes me want to run out and...no actually it makes me laugh. keep howling into the abyss and we'll keep winning elections.

Only way to go is for Democrats to mount massive attack campaign. Also, AARP hasn't responded properly or quickly enough. It's a joke when Novelli put his ok [in the dark behind member's backs], on current GOP Medicare Mess Bill. Now, he's treated like dirt, OR>>>>>>is his and AARP's really timid response to these outrageous attacks part of his [pro-GOP bias] to derail AARP and [fair insurance], along with Medicare/Social Security for seniors? Asking GOP to stop unfair attacks is not only WEAK...it's stupid. Fight and attack like mad against this with all political means possible...and FAST!!!

I understand that the lying s.o.b.'s at USA Next
are trying to smear AARP for standing up for Social Security. As an registered independent voter, as is my wife, we are tired of these lies
and smear campaigns. It seems that anything that is not pro business is automatically earmarked for destruction. The people that smeared John Kerry and now AARP are scum. They are the most regressive and selfish people on earth. I have no use for them. It seems that the followers of their way of thinking do not want to pay any taxes but want all the services and protection that they provide.
I have to tell you that I am retired and pay taxes on my retirement and Social Security and glad to do it. If I didn't pay taxes on my retirement income that would mean that I would be impoverished and couldn't hardly afford to eat. I guess I am lucky in this regard but I do not expect to get something for nothing. I also do not want wall street getting hold of any Social Security money. Social Security needs to be tweaked a little, not destroyed.
AARP take them on and tell it like it is. We will win if we expose all their lies.

Hey, I got your boycott right here!

Please pass this onto as many other people as you can especially on forums where independents can read.

Also put the url www.boycott-republicans.com on index cards and leave them in your libraries, supermarkets and post office bulletin boards.


How can the people force a mean spirited conservative congress to pass a progressive agenda? Simple. I have picked some well known companies that appear related to issues that progressives find important. Boycott these companies and make them lobby congress and get what we want or they go bust. While I agree we need to elect a Democratic congress and a Democratic president, with a consumer boycott we the people can exert influence every single day and not just at election time and not just with letters or petitions but with petitions with the bite of a boycott.

Join the revolution for progressive legislation

http://www.boycott-republicans.com

Write this url on your one, five and ten dollar bills.

Call Eckerd Pharmacy Corporate Headquarters at 800 325 3737, Call CVS Pharmacy Corporate headquarters at 888 607 4287 and Call Walgreens Pharmacy Corporate headquarters at 800 289 2273 and tell them you will not purchase any products from their drug stores until they get the Republican congress to repeal the faulty prescription drug benefit and replace it with a simple 80 percent coverage benefit under Medicare Part B. Then sign the petition.

Call Walmart at 800 WALMART and tell them you will not buy from them until they get the Republican congress to stop social security privatization, increase the minimum wage to TEN dollars an hour, and extend unemployment insurance for people who lost jobs and sought work for more than 6 months. then sign the petition.

Sign the petition to stop social security privatization, increase the minimum wage,extend unemployment insurance for people who lost jobs and sought work for more than 6 months and repeal the faulty Republican prescription drug benefit and replace it with a simple 80 percent coverage of medication under Medicare Part B. Please get two other people to sign this petition.

http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/progressive

Sign the petition to stop the War and Occupation in Iraq

http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/stopthewar


Boycott Wendy's Restaurants and Outback Steakhouses.

Why you say? Wendy's Restaurants operate out of Dublin, OHIO and Outback Steakhouses operate out of FLORIDA. Now you see. I have picked two well known companies that operate out of the states that have brought us stolen elections by the immoral Republican Party. These companies operate restaurant chains that have restaurants around the United States.

Now why boycott them after the effort to overturn Bush's second stolen election has failed? Boycott them, call them, email them and tell them that we will not go to their restaurants until Ohio and Florida elects democrats to Governorships, Secretaries of state and majorities in their legislatures in Ohio and Florida. In other words we will punish them for allowing the stolen elections to happen in 2000 and 2004. Will it work? Well do it and see.


I had a petition to demand a revote in Ohio and Florida at

http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/revote

but now I use it to allow people to express their opinions on the 2004 and 2000 stolen elections and encourage them to boycott Wendy's and Outback Steakhouse, 2 famously Republican contributors.

Thank you.

Also visit these fine websites

http://www.Buyblue.org

http://www.2005blue.com

http://www.choosetheblue.com

http://www.imblue.net

Now sign the petitions and spread the message!

another point. I hope the swift boat f*cks destroy AARP. AARP got taken over by the Republican Party when Bill Novelli (Nixon follower) and John Rother AARP policy director (Aide to the late Senator John Heinz R-PA) rose to their positions.

Join the ARA, Alliance for Retired Americans run by the AFLCIO. It costs 10 dollars per year and you don't have to belong to a union.

No damn Republican will take over this organization.

http://www.retiredamericans.org

Please pass this onto as many other people as you can especially on forums where independents can read.

Also put the url www.boycott-republicans.com on index cards and leave them in your libraries, supermarkets and post office bulletin boards.


How can the people force a mean spirited conservative congress to pass a progressive agenda? Simple. I have picked some well known companies that appear related to issues that progressives find important. Boycott these companies and make them lobby congress and get what we want or they go bust. While I agree we need to elect a Democratic congress and a Democratic president, with a consumer boycott we the people can exert influence every single day and not just at election time and not just with letters or petitions but with petitions with the bite of a boycott.

Join the revolution for progressive legislation

http://www.boycott-republicans.com

Write this url on your one, five and ten dollar bills.

Call Eckerd Pharmacy Corporate Headquarters at 800 325 3737, Call CVS Pharmacy Corporate headquarters at 888 607 4287 and Call Walgreens Pharmacy Corporate headquarters at 800 289 2273 and tell them you will not purchase any products from their drug stores until they get the Republican congress to repeal the faulty prescription drug benefit and replace it with a simple 80 percent coverage benefit under Medicare Part B. Then sign the petition.

Call Walmart at 800 WALMART and tell them you will not buy from them until they get the Republican congress to stop social security privatization, increase the minimum wage to TEN dollars an hour, and extend unemployment insurance for people who lost jobs and sought work for more than 6 months. then sign the petition.

Sign the petition to stop social security privatization, increase the minimum wage,extend unemployment insurance for people who lost jobs and sought work for more than 6 months and repeal the faulty Republican prescription drug benefit and replace it with a simple 80 percent coverage of medication under Medicare Part B. Please get two other people to sign this petition.

http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/progressive

Oh Good Grief

Seems like the cycle is peaking. The far right is strutting their stuff and getting excessive. I think they will choke on this.

hmmmm......nearly every Repugnican entry on this site applauds Karl Rove/Duh-bya and his use of sleaze and lies and slimy front groups like the Swift Boat worms. And these are the "moral value" folks, too. How does that work? When did a thick slimy coating become a moral value? The really difficult part for me is reading/listening to the sanctimonious crap from these hypocrites, lecturing the country on moral issues while applauding the lowest behavior. It's like a sermon delivered from a Tijuana whorehouse. How about a "moral value" that doesn't divide people, take someone else's land or possessions, or kill people that don't quite look like they're from Dallas.

First, let me state that I am a Republican, so I am not a leftist liberal guy by nature. Having said that, I still find myself amazed that a moron like Dubya ever got nominated by my
party,let alone "voted" into office. I miss the days when my party was dominated by politicians who did not believe in giving away my tax dollars to lazy bums who preferred collecting welfare rather than working. Now I see my party controlled by right wing "religious" conservatives whose goal is to make the rich richer and destroy the middle class. Karl Rove is the tactical leader of this group, and I hold him personally responsible for many of the programs that Bush is trying to ram down our throats. As a Republican, if I disagree with the Bush Administration's position, I am labeled as "unpatriotic". I wonder if that is what Germans who opposed Hitler's agenda in the 1930's were labelled as? Even the horrific 9/11 attacks have been used by the Bush Administration to scare us and ram their agenda down our throats (In this case, doing their best to take away our Constitutional rights.) Now everything they do is based upon lies, misrepresentations, and blatant smear tactics as we have seen in this ad. I am disgusted with what I see, and if the Republicans can not break away from the "religious" right and the vile group within my party that supports them, I am afraid that I will be forced to vote Democratic during the next Presidential election. Either way, I hope you succeed in stopping this disgusting ad.