Yeah sure........Bush wouldn't know "clumsy" if it bit him......he is so inept....he probably didn't even understand what was going on!!
Posted by Sister Faith at October 19, 2005 08:18 AMWhat did the president know and when did he know it.
Posted by at October 19, 2005 08:32 AMSeriously, who the fuck is George W. Bush to criticize Karl Rove for clumsy execution?
Posted by dj moonbat at October 19, 2005 08:35 AMIf accurate, this is extremely serious. Josh Marshall remarks on this story, and says he gives it some credence due to the byline.
Posted by Jonathan at October 19, 2005 08:42 AMActually Bush was probably upset that they targeted the relationship between Plame and Wilson as husband and wife. If you are giving out appointments based on relationships then critisizing someone else for doing the same probably didn't sit well. He probably just wanted them to make clear it wasn't the VP who nominated Wilson and didn't think it appropriate to include Plame's name - after all it was that detail that caused this whole mess.
Posted by OutsideTheEchoChamber at October 19, 2005 08:43 AMI think many people are missing just how big this news really is:
1) Bush knowingly lied when he said he didn't know who the leaker was, and would fire whoever was involved.
2) Bush wasn't upset over the fact that national security had been breached for political gain; he was upset that they got caught.
3) If all of this is true, then depending upon what Bush told the prosecutor, he may have perjured himself and participated in the conspiracy to cover it all up.
3) If all of this is true, then depending upon what Bush told the prosecutor, he may have perjured himself...
Bush wasn't under oath.
Posted by dj moonbat at October 19, 2005 08:56 AMThey may have turned the White House into the Best Little Whorehouse From Texas, but at least it's God's Best Little Whorehouse From Texas.
Can I get an 'Amen'?
Posted by Kevin Hayden at October 19, 2005 08:57 AMAmen!!
Posted by bushblowsturdblossom at October 19, 2005 09:00 AMIt doesn't matter that Bush wasn't under oath; people have gone to jail for lying to federal officials while not under oath (a recent Louisiana insurance commissioner comes to mind).
Posted by Brian Boru at October 19, 2005 09:02 AMthe "under Oath" part is all the Wingnuts care about...Clinton lied "under Oath". That's why Bush never testifies under oath.....lies are all he has. Oh, and if this story is true, I guess Condi won't be taking over for Dirty Dick either.
In the quoted story, notably absent in the group are Cheney,Bolton and Libby ????? Are we all on the wrong track? All along, I've said the Plame outing was pure Bush...now I'm thinking maybe I was right.
It doesn't matter that Bush wasn't under oath; people have gone to jail for lying to federal officials while not under oath (a recent Louisiana insurance commissioner comes to mind).
First, lying to federal officials and perjury are different crimes. Second, Bush cannot be tried for crimes while in office, except by impeachment.
Posted by dj moonbat at October 19, 2005 09:06 AMDJ,
You're right about the "under oath" part. However, I would imagine he could still count as a co-conspirator.
You're right about the "under oath" part. However, I would imagine he could still count as a co-conspirator.
Yep. I didn't mean to imply that these revelations are not a bombshell--they are. I really thought the dike would hold, and that the pretense that Bush knew nothing would stand. Now, Fitzmas may include those two wonderful words "unindicted co-conspirator."
Posted by dj moonbat at October 19, 2005 09:12 AMHm....failure to report knowledge of an ongoing criminal conspiracy in order to obstruct justice.....there goes Bush again, restoring integrity to the WH. God bless him.
Posted by ann at October 19, 2005 09:15 AMNo need to comment now, I’ll wait for next 5 posts.
Steve will have found some moonbat by then insuring the indictments of Laura, the twins and the guy who cuts Bush’s lawn.
West,
I don't blame you. If I were you, I wouldn't want to say much, either.
j.west, Your the bitch who cuts his lawn!!
Posted by bbtb at October 19, 2005 09:30 AMHas anyone seen this?
AntiWar's Justin Raimondo: "According to a source in the Italian embassy, Patrick J. "Bulldog" Fitzgerald asked for and "has finally been given a full copy of the Italian parliamentary oversight report on the forged Niger uranium document," the former CIA officer tells me:
"Previous versions of the report were redacted and had all the names removed, though it was possible to guess who was involved. This version names Michael Ledeen as the conduit for the report and indicates that former CIA officers Duane Clarridge and Alan Wolf were the principal forgers. All three had business interests with Chalabi."
If Fitzgerald has unredacted forged Niger documents and they name Michael Ledeen and two CIA agents, then there's more evidence that the entire rationale for war in Iraq was contrived by the administration. In other words, the Bush administration committed fraud on Congress and the American people.
jonathan (above) is correct. this is a big story.
the significance is political, not legal, and has nothing to do with being under oath or not.
what do you say to your country when you've implied for two years that you were just being fair and would take action against any leakers who were white house staff.
from the political perspective of the white house, to plant this story seems to me extremely clumsy and politically very dangerous.
the wheels really do seem to be coming off the bus.
much as we might like to sit back and enjoy the show, the problem is that the evolving situation is very dangerous for the country - an unstable presidency (and possibly president) with an authoritarian bent could spell a lot of trouble for us all.
but there is just a hint that james baker is going to ride into town, or may already be on the job.
Posted by orionATL at October 19, 2005 10:11 AMSteve will have found some moonbat by then insuring the indictments of Laura, the twins and the guy who cuts Bush’s lawn.
This just in: First Lady Laura Bush is resigning from the White House, citing extreme displeasure with enduring 26 years of inane, childish, irresponsible, moronic behavior.
The twins, 24, and are currently being coached for possible appearances as co-conspirators, and though there are few details, it seems to have something to do with cocaine and two guys named Di and Da.
Abdul, the Bush's groundskeeper, resigned last week and is believed to have returned to his hometown, Tehran.
We are also told in this piece that recent stories that Rove told Bush two years ago that he wasn’t involved were lies spread by White House aides to protect the president, presumably by putting the blame on Rove for lying to Bush.
Hold on, let me get this straight. Rove commits a crime, and then lies to Bush about doing it. Bush finds out, kicks Rove in the nuts, and then proceeds to lie about Rove's lie, which logically makes it the truth. However, as the whole thing started with a lie about uranium, we have a lie about a lie about a lie, which logically results in: a lie.
If I understand this correctly, this will result in the indictment of Jessica Simpson.
Hold on, let me get this straight. Rove commits a crime, and then lies to Bush about doing it. Bush finds out, kicks Rove in the nuts...
No, you've missed something: It's the recent stories (a couple days/weeks ago) that said Rove lied to Bush about his involvement. Before that, Rove theoretically had no involvement. Now, the "Rove had nothing to do with it" story is inoperative, so they were trying to insulate Bush.
Today's story means that, at the very latest, Bush knew about outing Plame after the story showed up in the press. Now, they have to worry about insulating him from the most damaging charge of all: knowing in advance. Right now, the President is looking like a conspirator after the fact, a "mere" obstructor of justice. If he becomes a conspirator to commit the original crime, things get even worse.
Posted by dj moonbat at October 19, 2005 10:50 AMWhether Bush was under oath when he lied to the special counsel is irrelevant -- Bush was at the center of the conspiracy to betray the CIA. This is treason, and impeachment is too good for these traitors.
Posted by ck at October 19, 2005 10:54 AMBush was at the center of the conspiracy to betray the CIA. This is treason...
It's not treason. Conspiracy, yes. Probably several other crimes. But the constitutional definition of treason is quite narrow.
Posted by dj moonbat at October 19, 2005 10:57 AMWe brought Nixon to the verge of impeachment for very similar offenses, the lies and the cover-up. Bush should be impeached.
Posted by roamer at October 19, 2005 11:01 AMWe brought Nixon to the verge of impeachment for very similar offenses, the lies and the cover-up. Bush should be impeached.
Things are getting so bad, Dems running for Congress may be able to run on an impeachment platform: "These criminals will never face justice unless you vote Democrat."
Posted by dj moonbat at October 19, 2005 11:05 AMSteve - That truly was the first spit-take I've done to a headline that wasn't intentionally funny that I can remember.
Surely the White House is kidding. This is like expecting them to find the Anthrax Mailer.
Posted by idiosynchronic at October 19, 2005 11:11 AMThis was simply hardball politics, and the above proves it. It ain't beanbag, but nowhere was any law broken.
That the moral leper Fitzgerald is trying to cobble together an indictment out of this is indicative of just how far the democrat party will go to criminalize politicians they don't agree with.
Fitzgerald should be ashamed. More than that, Fitzgerald should be fired and jailed.
Posted by Al at October 19, 2005 11:28 AMThat the moral leper Fitzgerald is trying to cobble together an indictment out of this is indicative of just how far the democrat party will go to criminalize politicians they don't agree with.
C'mon, you're not even the real Al. You're not even the real Fake Al. Get a new routine.
Posted by dj moonbat at October 19, 2005 11:34 AMare you sure fitzgerald shouldn't be executed and his ashes incorporated into a 100-foot gold statue of Dear Leader, flightsuit bulging? and what do we do with the marxist traitor ashcroft, whose DoJ appointed Fitzgerald?
squirm a little more, Al. This is getting better all the time.
Posted by benjoya at October 19, 2005 11:34 AMyes, fitzgerald very bad man. he prosecuted my organization, and i never hurt a fly!
Posted by osama at October 19, 2005 11:37 AMi'd like to see that mick sleeping with the fishes
Posted by john gotti at October 19, 2005 11:37 AMi'll never see the sun shine again thanks to that infidel, er, democrat. al, gotti, osama, and i are the only ones who know how evil this fitzgerald is.
Posted by ramsi yusef at October 19, 2005 11:39 AMnice friends you got, al.
Posted by benjoya at October 19, 2005 11:43 AMIt ain't beanbag, but nowhere was any law broken.
Another expert legal advisor speaks.
Posted by ann at October 19, 2005 11:53 AMIf a Republican does it, it's not illegal.
Posted by AL II at October 19, 2005 12:05 PMAL,
Go fuck yourself.
Posted by Cheney's Potty Mouth at October 19, 2005 12:57 PMREVENGE OF THE SPOOKS ????
two articles today referenced former intel agents or former CIA agents. has the CIA in the form of some of its retired officers taken on the white house and WHIG (white house iraq group)?
the 10/19 new york daily news article by meek and bazinet: : "an ex-intelligence officer said" and "a second former intel officer".
the 10/19 justin raimondo article at antiwar.com: "former CIA operations officer" and "former CIA officer" .
it's not a good idea to aggrevate the company. they don't just know where the bodies are buried; they know how to generate bodies for burial.
anybody else notice similar sources for WHIG or white house shenanigans?
Not a psychiatrist, nor do I play one on t.v., but President Bush's response bears an alarming resemblance to that of someone suffering borderline personality disorder or some form of sociopathy.
An utter disdain for ethics or social mores and complete focus on the injustice of being caught pretty much sums up practically every criminal in the county jail.
Posted by leolabeth at October 19, 2005 01:51 PMSociopath, or narcissistic personality, I'm more inclined to believe. Or just the tics of untreated alcoholism.
Posted by iamcoyote at October 19, 2005 02:17 PMSociopathic.
Posted by Judith at October 19, 2005 05:01 PMThe Daily News actually says Joseph Wilson "debunked" Bush's claim that Saddam sought uranium from Africa?
Wilson didn't debunk that. What Wilson found helped to support Bush's claim.
When Wilson went to Niger in February 2002, Niger’s former Prime Minister Ibrahim Mayaki told Wilson that, when an Iraqi delegation discussed "expanding commercial relations" with Niger in 1999, Mayaki interpreted the proposal to mean Iraq wanted to buy lightly enriched "yellowcake" uranium.
In other words, Mayaki thought Saddam's men were trying to buy uranium.
How would that "debunk" Bush's claim?
The truth is, Wilson came back saying he was confident Saddam had not actually bought the yellowcake. Only later did Wilson dishonestly expand his findings to contradict Bush's claim in 2003 that Saddam sought to buy the yellowcake.
Wilson also said his wife, Valerie Plame, had nothing to do with the CIA's sending him to Niger. That, too, was untrue.
Posted by Free Frank Warner at October 19, 2005 11:52 PMFree Frankenfurter, go peddle your "created false reality" elsewhere.
Posted by at October 20, 2005 05:34 AMFrank:
Save it for the next lunatic conservative this nation allows to be pRedzident. This one is beyond your rescue effort.
Posted by pessimist at October 20, 2005 05:35 AM