Jeff Sessions has brought in a family member of one of the 9-11 pilots to plead to let the president do this. What a fucking dick. What emotional manipulation. I am furious that they are using people in this way. It is emotional blackmail, pure and simple.
She has been fed an argument by the admin.
She is pleading that "this program is vital and should never have been exposed publicly."
Posted by Anjha at February 6, 2006 09:41 AMJeff Sessions has brought in a family member of one of the 9-11 pilots to plead to let the president do this. What a fucking dick. What emotional manipulation. I am furious that they are using people in this way. It is emotional blackmail, pure and simple.
Shorter Anjha: only those who agree with me can testify.
Can I testify? I lost a boyfriend on 9/11. I'd be happy to offer my desire to discontinue the program on his behalf.
Posted by ann at February 6, 2006 09:55 AMSessions is about the lowest of the low of these Senators.
One of our guys needs to shut his lies up. He reamed Pat Leahy yesterday - but Pat doesn't seem to know it.
Posted by Flamethrower at February 6, 2006 10:03 AMJeff Sessions has brought in a family member of one of the 9-11 pilots to plead to let the president do this. What a fucking dick. What emotional manipulation. I am furious that they are using people in this way. It is emotional blackmail, pure and simple.
Shorter Anjha: only those who agree with me can testify.
Posted by A Former Democ Rat at February 6, 2006 09:45 AM
*****
If (and when, given this administration's rank incompetence) Al Qaida strikes again, I hope YOU are in the target area, instead of a decent, innocent human being. You and the rest of the enablers of these incompetent, wretched fucks deserve that fate a hell of a lot more than a decent, hard-working, unassuming innocent does.
You're a goddamn traitor and an enabler of criminals. Fuck you. I hope you reap what you have sown.
The God of War wets his rubber pants again, he's so angry.
Posted by Murad at February 6, 2006 10:13 AMann, I lost any faith I had in the US government on 9-11, I wonder if they'll let me testify to stop the program. I have no doubt they already know how I feel about it, though.
Posted by iamcoyote at February 6, 2006 10:33 AMDid Sessions or other republicans tell this poor woman/9-11 victim something that the rest of the country can't know? Did they spill classified information in order to use her as a prop? Its interesting that the same republican operatives who accuse Cindy Sheehan of "ignorance", of "opportunism" of "being a tool" of acting out of "emotion" and not reason simply turn around and "use" an "uninformed" "emotional" "victim" of another great american tragedy *when it suits them* but then, of course, hypocrisy thy name is republican.
Here's the thing--if these unconstitutional, illegal, activities had the slightest effect on our position in the war on terror--could bring about the end of the Iraq war? Could stop the recruitment of terrorists? Could lead to the capture of Osama bin laden *they would have already* and the same administration that rushed to trumpet half successes and outright failures (Remember when they published the name of an al quaeda capture who had actually been turned and was a double agent? Remember when they exposed a CIA agent and claimed that it was a kind of "whistle blowing?") would already have spilled every data point. They have long used every bit of classified information in their scorched earth political struggle against their true enemy--the democrats. And they've suceeded very well in attacking and hurting other american citizens and civilians. What they have no demosntrated capability of doing is actually *fighting the war on terror* sucessfully. That is because, I'd submit, they simply don't view winning over al quaeda as a primary goal. Disabling and destroying american civil life and politics is their prime focus.
aimai
Posted by aimai at February 6, 2006 10:34 AM(Comment deleted by Host for irrelevance to thread)
Posted by dipshit at February 6, 2006 10:37 AMMurad, in looking at your IP address, you have had several identities and can’t seem to pick one.
You have been Mr. Damage, Wayne, Egon, Some Guy, Larry in Largo Fla, Duece, and now Murad. And of course, you’ve also posted anonymously.
So which ID will it be tomorrow when the meds wear off again?
The God of War wets his rubber pants again, he's so angry.
Posted by Murad at February 6, 2006 10:13 AM
*****
Says the coward unwilling to post under one screen name.
High irony.
Posted by God Of War at February 6, 2006 10:51 AMWith Alito on the bench and NSA spying on you its a wonder you all haven't been locked up yet. Maybe soon. Watch your back moonbats!
Posted by at February 6, 2006 10:55 AMaimai, it's obvious this administration hates America, except for the money they're funneling from the treasury to their pockets. It's the only thing that drives them. All the appropriations they've voted on have gone directly to them and their corporate cronies. Have you heard the Carlyle Group is bidding on ownership of the datamining project? Surprised that isn't making news.
The minions they send out to clutter up the blogs have traded their dignity, honor and souls for the absurd notion that they're on the winning "team." Sad how easy it is to manipulate these mentally challenged idiots with the "branding" of hatred. But what do you expect when a country is so deeply mesmerized by the corporate culture that they look forward to the Super Bowl for the commercials rather than the game itself?
Posted by iamcoyote at February 6, 2006 11:00 AMiamcoyote,
well said. And a great analogy to the superbowl/commercial thing.
aimai
Posted by aimai at February 6, 2006 11:07 AMThe minions they send out to clutter up the blogs have traded their dignity, honor and souls for the absurd notion that they're on the winning "team."
Posted by iamcoyote at February 6, 2006 11:00 AM
*****
Bingo.
And my oh my, look at what they've won. If that's "winning," it pyrrhic winning, and in fact, losing.
Can you just hear them? "Oh yeah! I got over on a lib! Sure, my wages are stagnant, I'm less safe, my freedoms are eroding, my rights are fading, my environment is turning to shit...but boy oh boy, Hannity's callers sure do love them some Sean! And I hit and run on lib blogs! I'm a warrior for W!"
Posted by God Of War at February 6, 2006 11:12 AMThanks, aimai; it just blows me away how readily people succumb to having their minds made up for them because thinking is hard. I recently saw a commercial announcing the debut of another commercial. How sick is that??
Posted by iamcoyote at February 6, 2006 11:14 AMThanks, aimai; it just blows me away how readily people succumb to having their minds made up for them because thinking is hard. I recently saw a commercial announcing the debut of another commercial. How sick is that??
Posted by iamcoyote at February 6, 2006 11:14 AM
*****
For the five-bladed razor, right? Yeah, what a goddamn innovation THAT is. Break out the ticker tape and champagne.
Goddamn...if engineers put as much thought into renewable energy as they do into rigging as many blades as possible onto a razor, this world would be a better place.
Posted by God Of War at February 6, 2006 11:22 AMI remember a comedy sketch from SNL or Mad TV or some such about a razor that kept adding and adding blades. It was funny at the time, now it's reality. And it's sick.
Posted by iamcoyote at February 6, 2006 11:32 AMBy the way, that last anonymous posting at 10:55 was from Cyber Sarge, who for some reason didn't want to use his name today.
Posted by Steve Soto at February 6, 2006 11:51 AMActually, Chief, that's about the most accurate thing sarge has said.
Aimai nails it though, if they'd had any successes we'd be hearing it in orgasmic tones 24/7.
And of course, the real problem with the NSA spying is that we've no reason to trust bushco to limit itself to ferriner's phone calls. I mean, they've started a war for no good god damned reason except to show they could, what's going to stop them from listening to Joe Lefty Liberal calling his fellow DFA member to talk strategy, or reading Pat Leahy's mail, etc? Some legal nicety from the gang that thinks the President can do whatever he wants?
Posted by Duckman GR at February 6, 2006 12:23 PM
WORTHLESS
Firts day, first witness, and the pro-torture "Bush is king" attorney general isn't even sworn in. Of course, the DEM politicians do nothing.
They should have shut the Govt. down until this Felony and violation of the US Constiution is properly investigated. Then they should have put Gonzalas and every NSA staffer on notice that it may take three years or it may take seven years but when the corrupt Republicans are out of office you will re-open the case and put everyone who commited a crime in prison. Same with the CIA torturers and the military brass that allowed it - PRISON TIME - "we will eventually prosecute you and you will go to prison".
But that won't happen.
Hey, DEM POLITICIANS - go home. Just go home. Go home and drink a beer, you are not needed. You aren't doing anything anyway.
Go home.
===================
Sessions is a smirking little fuckwit.
Posted by angryspittle at February 6, 2006 12:56 PMA Former Democ Rat
What happened? What made you a republi-con? The Nazi hate mongering get to you? Or did you shit yourself at each new "Terra" alert? If you support this shit so much, why don't you enlist? Seems reasonable to me. They let you have Rush-the-Lush, Hanoi-Hannity, and O'Strifely over there. That nazi Glenn Beck, too.
I get it! You are really Al Qaeda! Fucking terrorist! No need to fear if you aren't. The NSA will sort you out when they look at your records...maybe.
Posted by phidipides at February 6, 2006 12:57 PM - - OT - -
By the way, that last anonymous posting at 10:55 was from Cyber Sarge, who for some reason didn't want to use his name today.
What kills me is that I suspect I have a higher chance of being DDOS'd, mailed threatening notes, having my truck windows shot out, & having my idenity thieved and turned-in to Homeland Security if I was post as a liberal in the clear than these morons do as trolls on a liberal blog. Other than God of War, these bozos have little to wet their pants over.
Of course, that's not the point, is it?
Posted by idiosynchronic at February 6, 2006 12:59 PMSen. Chuckles Grassley: "With Bin Laden still threatening us, should we even be sitting hear today?" How about since Bush obviously has been ineffective in getting Bin Laden, should he still be sitting in the White House, today?
Grassley, Cornyn, and Brownback are threating the very premise of checks and balances. Durbin and Leahy were great.
Posted by TIKI AL at February 6, 2006 01:06 PMSen. Chuckles Grassley: "With Bin Laden still threatening us, should we even be sitting hear today?" How about since Bush obviously has been ineffective in getting Bin Laden, should he still be sitting in the White House, today?
Grassley, Cornyn, and Brownback are threating the very premise of checks and balances. Durbin and Leahy were great.
Posted by TIKI AL at February 6, 2006 01:06 PM
*****
The rank cowardice spewing forth from these GOParasites is truly astounding. What a bunch of bedwetting sissies!
Posted by God Of War at February 6, 2006 01:20 PMStv, thnks fr th nc wrk; dng sm blg plc wrk, t.
Cyt, hv y lkd t Td Nc’s wrk t http://www.gngsfmrc.cm/gngsfmrc.pdf; thnk tht y wll fnd t mst ntrstng nd cnncts wth yr pnt. ( plgz f lrdy mntnd ths st; cn’t rmmbr n blg frm nthr.)
d, pls chck t ths st, http://cf.hffngtnpst.cm/, nd clck n th #2. ‘l Qd Cllr .D.' t’s hlrs nd cnncts wth yr pnt.
hvn’t hd chnc t chck n dmg cntrl fr th pst fw dys. Thnks gn Stv.
I was certain when Joe Klein claimed his reportorial expertise having led to a "truer" understanding of the parameters of the surveillance, and he attacked Eric Alterman for a percieved "opinion mongering", that Gonzalez would would take precisely that line in his opening remarks.
Can you believe that anyone with an IQ higher than a hampster would believe anything the Bushites might have to say? Klein is either a utter fool, or on the pad. No one who claims to be a journalist can be that credulous.
Posted by at February 6, 2006 01:54 PMIn today's New York Post, Debra Burlingame connects some dots:
A 2004 NBC report graphically illustrated what not having this program cost us 4 1/2 years ago. In 1999, the NSA began monitoring a known al Qaeda "switchboard" in Yemen that relayed calls from Osama bin Laden to operatives all over world. The surveillance picked up the phone number of a "Khalid" in the United States--but the NSA didn't intercept those calls, fearing it would be accused of "domestic spying."
After 9/11, investigators learned that "Khalid" was Khalid al-Mihdhar, then living in San Diego under his own name--one of the hijackers who flew American Airlines Flight 77 into the Pentagon. He made more than a dozen calls to the Yemen house, where his brother-in-law lived.
NBC news called this "one of the missed clues that could have saved 3,000 lives."
______________________
So I guess Ann's boyfriend should be happy that his life was taken so that a terrorist's rights could be preserved.
As pointed out in other blogs, Gonzo is insistent if nothing else. He is well-coached and keeps raising the spectre of fear as programmed. The mainstream media seems to be accepting this tacitly as a fierce Administration defense of warrantless wiretapping. I hear Biden and Leahy and Feingold are sharply questioning--however, we need an experienced criminal prosecutor leading the Democratic interrogation. What I hear from Sen Specter is acceptable, but he will do nothing to cross the Republicans and will look for the first exit he can exploit (IMHO). Gonzo-Bonzo-and the NeoConzos need to be pressed much harder with fireworks of the sort the Mainstream Press will have an orgasm over. Coverage seems very, very flat. This is going to be forgotten without deeper coverage in the mainstream.
Posted by gtash at February 6, 2006 02:21 PMCarpe, was Khalid al-Mihdhar an American citizen? Nope, didn't think so. So, spying on him would have been okay.
Posted by ann at February 6, 2006 02:39 PM Firedoglake has a good description of the hearing.
It must be great to believe in double standards system because the highest standard is applied to Democrats and the lowest possible standard to Republicans. No wonder it is so easy to denigrate Republicans since they hold themselves bound by no ethical, moral or legal standards.
Perhaps that is why there are so many "former Democrats." They were simply tired to having to hold themselves to higher standards.
NBC news called this "one of the missed clues that could have saved 3,000 lives." Posted by Carpediem
Peace be upon you, God of War.
Posted by Couldn't Care Less About Screen Names at February 6, 2006 02:55 PMAnn,
Please tell me that you aren't this ignorant about wire taps.
You seem to suggest that all wiretaps are okay provided the individual living domestically is not an American Citizen?
Thats just not the law and I suspect you may have regretted that post.
The real point of contention is whether the NSA can monitor phone calls that either originate to or from a foreign state. Does any American have the right not to have their international calls not monitored.
An example by analogy is when you are on vacation and you return to the US. You have no CIVIL RIGHTS with regard to searches and seizures. They can pat you down, look in your bags and do all of this WITHOUT A WARRANT.
I don't hear you liberals screaming about that invasion of privacy and of civil rights. NO PROBABLE CAUSE, NO WARRANT is necessary.
The same rule is being used to apply to telephone calls originating from or to a foreign terrorist.
Now Steve and Pissymist, tell me why you aren't objecting to these seizures?
Out of curiosity, how many of you don't fly anymore either because he can be searched there to without a warrant too. STOP THE PRESSES!!
Posted by Carpediem at February 6, 2006 03:07 PMWhy did Bush say in april 04 that warrants WERE required for wiretapping and now when he gets caught says they don't need warrants? Did they change the law in the last 2 years?
Posted by Goose1 at February 6, 2006 03:33 PMIn 2002 the President of the United States, George W. Bush, issued an executive order which authorized the National Security Agency (NSA) to conduct warrantless phone-taps of persons who were believed to be linked to al-Qaeda or its affiliates. (The complete details of this authorization are still not fully known). The NSA maintained wiretaps on international communications, including those that included U.S. citizens on American soil. Such spying on U.S persons without the approval of the United States Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court is believed by many legal experts to be barred under the 1978 Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA).
Carpe, just to dumb down the issue for you a bit, the above is from wiki. The point I have made and everyone else has made but you seem to have problems comprehending is that it is a violation of the Fourth Amendment for Bush to illegally wiretap phone calls on American citizens without a warrant. My point remains that we have never said that it was illegal to wiretap someone who is not an American citizen.
Posted by ann at February 6, 2006 03:41 PMCarpe, the situation you cite would not have been remedied by NSA spying against American citizens. Bob Graham has said so, and he knows truckloads more about this than both of us.
Posted by Steve Soto at February 6, 2006 03:52 PMThank you Steve for identifying those who come here to disrupt.
I listened most of the day to the hearing, and actually was impressed with the Democrats and some Republicans. My general sense today was the illegal activity of spying gained no grounds for acceptance by those present (other than the usual ass kissers).
My favorite part was when Feingold accused Gonzales of lying and misleading the Senate during his confirmation hearing a year ago when he avoided answering a question about whether the president could authorize warrantless wiretapping of U.S. citizens. He had refused to answer a "hypothetical situation" Feingold accused him of lying to be confirmed. Of course, Gonzales will never pay for that little white lie.
Posted by Judith at February 6, 2006 05:05 PMWhy did Bush say in april 04 that warrants WERE required for wiretapping and now when he gets caught says they don't need warrants? Did they change the law in the last 2 years?
Goose1, it's that old play on words/subjects. The statement is true if you are referring to spying on Americans. So, in essense he wasn't lying, at least in his mind. He just failed to mention that other part of the spying story.
Posted by Judith at February 6, 2006 05:21 PMDear Libs,
Compare the warrantless searches and seizures of American Citizens upon their RETURN from a foreign country and the warrantless wiretaps of American Citizens when speaking to a Foreign Terrorist.
Why don't you scream and hollar about these warrantless searches too?
Because you know that you have not be consistent.
Plain and simple.
Posted by carpediem at February 6, 2006 07:16 PMDear Libs,
Compare the warrantless searches and seizures of American Citizens upon their RETURN from a foreign country and the warrantless wiretaps of American Citizens when speaking to a Foreign Terrorist.
Why don't you scream and hollar about these warrantless searches too?
Because you know that you have not be consistent.
Plain and simple.
Posted by carpediem at February 6, 2006 07:16 PM
****
Dear Dumbshit,
It's because we're aware the first part of your example is the law and the second part of your example is against the law. Plain and simple.
Now, Crappy, as to my prior post, why do you always parse this argument to include foreign terrorists? The main reason that people are upset is that Bush may have used this illegal wietapping on domestics only, no foreign terrorists involved. I seriously doubt Quakers, for example, are cavorting with Al-Queda. But you always bring the argument back full circle to foreign terrorists. I guess they must teach you that in talking points school.
Posted by sf at February 6, 2006 07:45 PMCalling Abu Gonzales "Gonzo" makes baby Hunter Thompson cry and throw back another shot.
Don't do it.
-idio "The Great Gonzo" synchronic
Posted by idiosynchronic at February 6, 2006 08:16 PMYeah.
Crappy's got a point!
And how come I can't just carry my 357 magnum in my concealed shoulder holster onto the plane with me? That's a violation of my 2nd Amendment rights!!!!
Simpleton debate 101 is fun!
Posted by snark at February 7, 2006 06:22 AMCompare the warrantless searches and seizures of American Citizens upon their RETURN from a foreign country and the warrantless wiretaps of American Citizens when speaking to a Foreign Terrorist.
Why don't you scream and hollar about these warrantless searches too?
What's wrong? Your handlers miss the emailed talking points today? Christ, I can give you better neo-con arguments than this. While I work that up, you get back to your daily routine. You know, polishing your jack boots and snapping your right arm at 45 degrees to your body. No need to think about anything. Someone else will continue doing that for you.