All discussions about the folly of turning against Iran assume that sending the region more quickly into hell *isn't* the administration's goal. Hopefully, it isn't. But what if it is?
Posted by Brian Boru at April 3, 2006 10:04 AMNever underestimate the stupidity of white America and I say white because white males have turned out to be the dumbest in the land. Hey - the gop always has the gay card to get out these nuts.
Posted by jj at April 3, 2006 10:09 AM"Iran, unlike Iraq, will be able to cause us much military and economic harm if we strike,"
Understatement of the year. World oil production has peaked. It has been flat for several years and only barely covers ever-rising demand. Iran produces a considerable 4 million barrels per day of the world's total of about 84 million barrels per day. Remove the 4 million and we will have an oi shock like the 70's. IT ONLY TAKES A SMALL PERCENTAGE REDUCTION TO DO THIS.
But it gets worse. Iran commands the Straits of Hormuz through which the Saudi oil is tanked. The latest Iranian wargames are a clear message: a few torpedoes and missiles and oil-based economies will be in the dark.
To put it succinctly: Bomb Iran on Monday and America will have long gas lines and $8 or $10 or higher per gallon prices by Friday. Depression, chaos? Hell breaks loose.
Posted by geo at April 3, 2006 10:12 AMI found the Zinni comments coming from Father Timmeh's show interesting, especially the part where he says that those that remain(ed) silent on the issue in public about the policy mistakes/blunders and horrible planning....Ahem paging Mr. Powell and Mr. Franks, you're being called out on the carpet here by Zinni. And Zinni's concern about those who are still in a position of power failing to speak out holds true for those General's that continue to spout the administration's line about the situation...including imo, Abizaid and Pace. They are doing a disservice to our country by keeping their mouths shut on this horrific failure that will always in my history book be called, Junior Bush's Failed Iraq War that led to the downfall of the US.
Posted by emal at April 3, 2006 10:23 AM"But will the gop be able to bamboozle people into voting for them again...."
Why not?
They bamboozled them into believing Saddam had weapons of mass destruction when there was no evidence of such found by the IAEC.
They bamboozled them into believing Saddam was on the verge of getting a nuclear weapon when there was no "non-faked" evidence of that either.
They bamboozled them into believing that when no WMDs were found the war was really all about democracy.
They bamboozled them into believing that tax cuts for the wealthy were really in their best interests and that there is no correlation between those cuts and the fact that the national debt now stands at $9 trillion.
The bamboozled them into believing that handing Halliburton billions in no-bid contracts had to be done because it was "the only company that could do the job."
They bamboozled them into believing that George W. Bush has a brain.
After that, bamboozling them into believing a war on Iran would be a good thing ought to be a piece of cake.
Posted by PretzelsOne at April 3, 2006 10:35 AMThe United States has signaled that a new term for Prime Minister Jaafari was a nonstarter, because of his inability or unwillingness to rein in the sectarian death squads operating under his nose.
Yes, that was the pretext for undermining Jaafari.
Posted by KM at April 3, 2006 10:36 AMWatched several good docus this weekend. If you have not seen it, I highly recommend:
Uncovered: The War on Iraq
2004 Director Robert Greenwald
"The updated version of this controversial documentary -- which takes you behind the walls of the U.S. government as CIA, Pentagon and Foreign Service experts address the government's reasons for launching the "preemptive" war on Iraq in 2003 -- includes almost 30 minutes of brand new footage. Paired with this title is director David O. Russell's controversial antiwar documentary, Soldier's Pay."
There are many experts in this flick who denounce what was done. It clearly shows how the admin manipulated the media and the people and how they squashed any intel that disagreed with what they wanted to do.
This should be shown primetime with a fake tv guide announcement of American Idol or some such crap. People need to see this. People who are too lazy to do the research.
Ditto on General Zinni. He is fantastic. Currently he is defending himself on CSPAN from the loyalists.
As has been noted repeatedly, anyone who thinks the Rove Branch of the ReligiousRightNutWing of the GOP is going to sit passively by and watch the GOP lose in Novemeber is nuttier than Rove. There is no end to what will be done to hang on, by the smallest %, to power. Understand that point, and you'll have a window into how nasty, and dangerous, the next six months are going to be. No one, inside or outside of this country, is safe.
Posted by T2 at April 3, 2006 11:35 AMThe United States has signaled that a new term for Prime Minister Jaafari was a nonstarter, because of his inability or unwillingness to rein in the sectarian death squads operating under his nose.Yes, that was the pretext for undermining Jaafari.
I forgot to add how revoltingly hypocritical this is.
Posted by KM at April 3, 2006 11:52 AMAs has been noted repeatedly, anyone who thinks the Rove Branch of the ReligiousRightNutWing of the GOP is going to sit passively by and watch the GOP lose in Novemeber is nuttier than Rove. There is no end to what will be done to hang on, by the smallest %, to power. Understand that point, and you'll have a window into how nasty, and dangerous, the next six months are going to be. No one, inside or outside of this country, is safe.
Posted by T2 at April 3, 2006 11:35 AM
*****
If they go to the extremes that you imply, they'll be the least safe of all.
I guarantee it.
Posted by God Of War at April 3, 2006 12:02 PMGOW, they've already gone to those extremes. And they're still in office, largely because of it.
Posted by T2 at April 3, 2006 01:16 PMGeo posted on 3 April 2006 at 10:12 AM:
But it gets worse. Iran commands the Straits of Hormuz through which the Saudi oil is tanked. The latest Iranian wargames are a clear message: a few torpedoes and missiles and oil-based economies will be in the dark.
To put it succinctly: Bomb Iran on Monday and America will have long gas lines and $8 or $10 or higher per gallon prices by Friday. Depression, chaos? Hell breaks loose.
Bingo, Geo! Iran doesn't need to conduct terrorist attacks around the world, in the US or Europe. Dubya's security apparat is spreading this rumor now so that any provocation they enact later can be blamed on Iran. Iran can just strike at the numerous targets on their doorstep to cause the pain they want to inflict or to force others to turn on the US. Why go 5000 mile when you can go just 5000 paces? The logic shows the truthiness of Dubya's posse's pronouncement. This intelligence release is just pablum for the braindead.
But will the GOP be able to bamboozle people into voting for them again based on an agenda of unending war and immigrant bashing?
Is that some kind of sick joke? Of course they will!
I want five minutes with that bloated, Straussian boytoy Hitchens. If I hear him mention "my good friend Salmon Rushdie", or, how "George W. Bush is striking blows for secularism" one more time, Im gonna hunt his sorry bought-and-paid-for ass down.
Posted by jondee at April 4, 2006 12:36 AMI heard a little of Zinni today on NPR and he was complaining about the complete absense of accountability and yea he says he won't run, but I'd vote for him- cause he's a realist. The Brits need to leave and soon before Jr starts a war with Iran. they really do not need to get caught up in that.
Posted by emel at April 4, 2006 10:31 PM