They probably don't need to collect funds now, since the administration has kept them fat with "faith based" taxpayer cash from federal grants and cash-cow agencies like FEMA.
Think about it: no need to beg and plead---just fill out the paperwork and hire a lobbyist.
Posted by Hank at April 10, 2006 01:01 PMI know that Jesus Christ would be annoyed by these people. And so would Mahatma Gandhi and Mother Theresa. Let that be a lesson.
Posted by tempus at April 10, 2006 01:12 PMPss, y’r n trgt. Hwvr, pls rmmbr tht rlgn, thr tr f th Bbl (nt th Bbl f ths dmns y pntd t n th bv) r pgn, hs lwys bn th cltrl cntr pst nd lgtmtr f ny scty. Wht y r vltng s th ‘Chrstn’ bcklsh t th nwr rplcmnt pgn rlgn f crprt chc: Sclr Hmnsm. nd ths nw rlgn s prppd by r prcptn f scnc s n nswr t r prcvd clsd systm f ntrlsm, (tht s, wtht th trth f Jhvh). Th bty/dprvty f r crprtns, s ny pst sccssfl mprl pwr ndrstnds, s tht thy dn’t cr wht rlgn, r rlgns, th msss mbrc wthn thr dmnn, s lng s ts nt th trth f th Bbl. Bcs th Bbl shws s tht r vry ntr s vl; wll, th crp lrds thnk tht ths s wy t cls t th trth f ndrstndng thm!
Ths y cn s hw r crp lrds f Bldrbrg s whtvr ‘rlgn’ tht blws wth thr wnd f pwr nd prft, mns n. Nt th Trth f th Bbl, s w nt tht Clvn nd Crmwll ndrstd.
Nw, thr’s nthr trth cnnctd hr, bt hrd t xprss. Jhvh s nvlvd wth vrythng n Hs nvrs. Ths nclds vrythng dwn t th nsgnfcnt. r vry brthng s dn by Hm. knw, ths pprs mystcl, bt t s cmpltly Bblcl. Th nly spct f crtn tht Gd dd nt crt s th rblln gnst Hm. Bt Chrst s sng ths vry rblln, smthng Gd dd nt crt, t mk fr Hmslf ppl. Ths s crtcl: H ss mn’s rblln by lttng mnknd prs vl fr slf-gn. Chrst, slly gntly, brngs n f th rblls t Trth, (whch s smply ndrstndng tht H xsts, fr strtrs) thrgh th vl gnrtd by hs fllw mn. Nw y knw why Chrst tld th chsn t ‘lv thy nmy,’ fr Gd s sng th ‘nmy’ t brng th chsn t Trth.
t gts glr. Gd vws ll ths tht r nt f Hs chsn, (‘chsn,’ r ths tht H wll nt dstry whn H clns hs) s lrdy dd. (Bt hrt n f Hs ‘chsn,’ nd y’ll hrt Gd Hmslf.) Ths, whn w s Chrst sng mn’s dsr fr dth nd dstrctn s tl fr Hm t crt ppl fr Hmslf, Gd vws th nsvd s wlkng dd. Whl thy r kllng, xtrtng, rpng, stlng, sdmzng, lyng, chtng, tc., ch thr, Chrst s cnstntly wrkng wthn r rlty mtrx f vl crtng cndtns t sl Hs chsn, n by n.
S, ys, Chrst dsn’t knw ths Gdlss dts tht y s btflly xps n yr wll thght-t pc, bt H hs sd ths lvrs f rblln t rch Hs wn. f y sspnd yr dsblf fr fw scnds, y’ll nt tht th Trth ds ndd hrt, nd hrts lk hll.
Scout: what the hell is wrong with you? You are doing a great disservice to your church and God (if there is one). Keep your religion to yourself.
Posted by tempus at April 10, 2006 01:20 PMReligion has allows been a huge outlet for the existential angst and the starved imaginations of huge swath of Americans. Alot of people may not like that (sometimes) ugly reality, but thats the the way it is. To deny it because we dont like it is playing right into the fascists hands. Debs "my socialism comes from the Sermon on the Mount" understood this, and King certainly understood this. The many liberal and radical priests, ministers, rabbis and theologians need to grow some balls, summon some populist fire and cauterize this morally and intellectually bankrupt movement once and for all through open public debate and confrontation.
Posted by jondee at April 10, 2006 02:41 PMif this area of thought interests you,
please read gary wills' (prof of history, northwestern u.) exceptional article in this sunday's (4/9/06) new york times "week in review" section.
wills, a catholic, but not an "institutional catholic" is one of the most trenchant commentators about religious ideology, self-serving religious leaders, and the bane of our society at present - religiosity.
his nytimes article about the relation between jesus' teachings and worldly government strikes me as both beautiful and true.
another of his op-eds (or was it a book review) in the last couple of years provided me with historical info on the docrine of papal infallibility.
his comments are uncorrupted by his emotional ties to faith and the Church.
God damn-it!! Here I was, ready to join the Moral Majority and make some real cash, then I find out it's all gone to hell in a handbasket. Jesus shit's, now I have to find another religion to pander with trying to convince people that they will all burning in hell because god and "hay-zeus" love them so much. You know, like Scout's god. A vicious son-of-a-bitch who loves the monkey-men he created so much that he will burn them all in hell. Now that's love! And only a hundred thirty some-odd-thousand get to go to heaven, eh Scout? Fuck it! I'm going to whore, smoke, drink and eat the wrong shit, and continue cussing people I don't like. If I'm chosen, good. No church can help me. My huge ass Broke Back Mountain liberal faggot lifestyle is just dandy with God. If not, good. I'll have lived a full and annoying life.
Posted by phidipides at April 10, 2006 03:18 PMHeard Cornel West speak this past weekend and a couple things he said come to mind: What we have today is prosperity religion, market spirituality. Some of these big churches don't make any sense from a Christian perspective. You should expect to see two ATMs in these churces before you see a cross. Don't confuse success with greatness.
Posted by Mike at April 10, 2006 03:21 PMI believe we are looking at where the money to buy the best government there is comes from. And it comes through a pipeline that passes through the pulpit. Money gifted to God is spent by God's representatives to buy a kingdom for God and they have the nerve to call it, a kingdom, democracy.
The term "under God" was added to the pledge during the Eisenhower administration. This marks the 50th aniversary. At the same time the unconstitutional granting of tax dollars to the church from the federal government also began very quietly. It's now overt. What this tells us is that the super rich are buying the government with our money. Guess they are doing our shopping for us. At the time, 1956 war hero Ike was afraid that Godless communism was about to gain a foothold in America. That's what he said at the time as I recall. At least the man on the street understood it that way. Now we are left to wonder if it was Ike or a group that felt threatened by communism, the super wealthy that were scared.
The constitution can be ammended while the "Declaration of Independence" stands as written and signed by all incorporators. It's too late to write, "...all men are created equal except Jesus." I think that the "missing Jesus" in the DI is a thorn in the evangelical side they would get out if they could.
Is there the slightest chance the evangelical strangle hold on the government can be broken? Perhaps any breaking of it will require the cooperation of the super wealthy. Then again, the founders were relying on the "wisdom of the people" to make democracy work. And they called upon Nature's God for help. Is She helping? There's a thing called the Internet. You're using it right now. It bypasses the media that is clearly controlled. And it's being used to announce that the Bible, the soldiers manual for the evangelicals is a proved hoax. Since this has received no recognition in the main stream media most think it's a joke.
The Bible being proved a hoax is not a joke. The information has been transmitted around the world and is in capable hands all over the world. It won't be lost and it won't go away and it will continue to be heard if no other way than the Internet.
It's at: http://www.hoax-buster.org
The question to be answered is, can one person, a real nobody make a difference? Time will tell.
Posted by Bill at April 10, 2006 03:58 PMThat the Scaifes (may he smoke a turd in purgatory), Kochs, Coors,Richardsons are behind so much of this shouldnt come as any big suprise. We're obviously at a point now where an orangutan with name recognition can get elected president, so why shouldnt people buy a WWF version of religion? The Randian right working to make the working class intellect so small it can be drowned in a bathtub.
Posted by at April 10, 2006 05:18 PMThat was me.
Posted by jondee at April 10, 2006 05:24 PMI'm going OT to make a related point here.
Scout has been getting lambasted for bring his religion to the discussion, even when he's also making good secular-based points. Bill, on the other hand, is bringing his good secular-based no-religion information to the discussion, and yet he's not getting blasted for being on the other end of the spectrum.
I want to state here that I can live with both positions as long as both bring valid points and add to the discussion. It's when we get bandwidth-wasters (you all know who they are) that I am likely to cut off the thread if it's mine to cut off.
I don't want to abridge anyone's religious expression, but this is a secular political and current event blog. As long as the discussion is on topic, I wish that qualification to be taken into account by the commenters before anyone gets flamed for introducing religion into the thread. It's easier to focus on the topic as if uninterrupted than it is to lose it to rancorous debate.
The next time I open up the Free Speech Zone, I will have that be the seed topic. We can discuss my idea then.
Back on topic, please!
Posted by pessimist at April 10, 2006 05:26 PM"Bill, on the other hand, is bringing his good secular-based no-religion information to the discussion, and yet he's not getting blasted for being on the other end of the spectrum."
Pessimist, not true. I have more than once told him to find another site to discuss his position, as this is not a religious site. Personally, I have been offended by his postings, because he doesn't know of what he speaks.
OK, Judith. Point noted. Save the rest for the Free Zone. This thread is about the Teleban going broke, not scout or Bill.
Posted by pessimist at April 10, 2006 05:49 PMThe Bible being proved a hoax is not a joke.
The Bible is not a hoax and I condemn anyone to hell forever for saying so. It's these kind of asinine comments that give Christians of all faiths a bad name, and causes them to be the most persecuted peoples in Uh-mer-kuh. You will no doubt be condemned to an eternity of pain in a lake of fire housed within Courtney Love's massive and syphilitic vagina. Get thee behind me, bill!
Parity assurred.
Scout has been getting lambasted for bring his religion to the discussion, even when he's also making good secular-based points.
Even clinically paranoid people have their enemies. That is, even lunatics (thanks, Paracelsus) can show some form of rationality. The reason scout gets lambasted for its religion is because it is one of hatred and death, not a religion of love. It is one-step below snake handling and sipping strychnine. When you house rational secular debate within perverted biblical analyses you get what you ask for. I personally draw the line when anyone condemns homosexuals for the problems of the United States. On one side is me. On the other side are assholes like scout. If there is a Satan, I can assure you he/she would be exactly like scout. If I were in a bar and scout blathered its nonsense to me it would have its jaw wired shut and eat through a straw for 6 weeks.
Just my opinion.
Posted by phidipides at April 10, 2006 05:56 PMphid - You got me on the Paracelsus reference. Where is he when we need him? As for the rest, I know its been said many times before but, think closet cases, many closet cases. As Blake said: War is Energy Enslaved.
Posted by jondee at April 10, 2006 06:22 PMPss, ys, try t py rtnr (httng pltcl/sclr pnts) tht wll llw m t nt nly lrn frm vryn, bt hv fn nd smtms b srs by lvng cmmnts wthn th bst frmwrk f ntgrty tht my bld. Ths, hnr th hst by mkng sr tht m n tpc whl wvng vrs nstttnl fctrs tht wld thrws rmn thr hddn r msndrstd. try t strt nd nd wth n f th hst’s pnts. Why wld nyn b pst wth hw bld cs, r bld strw mn, s Phd wld rg.
Why wld nyn dshnr ll th wrtng hsts f ths mst xcllnt st by bng ff-tpc? ff tpc=dsrspct fr hst nd fllw cmmnttrs.
Phd, dn’t tk nythng sy prsnlly. Pls nt tht spk f ll mnknd bng nntly vl. dn’t pnt fngrs t thrs ntl lk n th mrrr frst. vn thn dn’t lk fr flth n ndvdls bcs, bfr Chrst, t ds nt mttr. t th pnt f cncptn, w r ll crrptd. Thrfr, f w wr n br tgthr, wld nt spk f hmsxls nd scl cnnctns, nlss y brght p th tpc. Why wld try t pst y? t wld prv nthng t m bcs knw tht nd ll thrs r nntly flwd. My wknss cld b prhps lkng t btfl ldy n nn-scnd t lng. wld hp tht y wldn’t jm m p fr my prtclr wknss.
ls, Phd, m jst bt t rcvr frm trfl lghtr wth yr ‘Crtny Lv's mssv nd syphltc vgn’ pctr. Wll, thght ws bt t rcvr, bt cn hrdly s th scrn rght nw bcs f nthr trfl! B dvsd tht dn’t drnk. Hwvr, Phd, y spk f m wrtng ‘ht;’ wld y pls r-rd yr cmmnt, sn’t tht rl ht? D y s hw w r? W ls lk t th ppst pltcl cmp, nd spk f ht. Yt, w ftn mrly prjct r wn htfl prsnlty pn thrs. W lk t thrs, s rslvs, nd ht rslvs, bt blm th thr fr r wn slf-lthng. Th blly syndrm xsts frm th lvl f ndvdls n p t th ntrctns btwn ntns. My Bblcl pnts m t th cr whr ths prblm dvlps: rslvs. sk y, hw cn w xpct pltcl ntns t wrk tgthr whn t s nr mpssbl fr ndvdls t xchng ds whn frm th sm cltr? mpssbl? Ys t s mpssbl, bt w try nyhw.
wnt t rcgnz Jdth. Thnks fr bng thr.
Pss, njyd yr ntr wrk, bt spclly yr cnclsn. ls, s tchr, th kds hv gd dys nd bd dys. Th gd dys r slly s stllr tht wndr hw t cn b s sy? f nly bcs frgt whn th grp hs ndrlyng nrgy nt rltd t th tpc t hnd. Y s tht xct cycl n cmmntry thghts: sm xcllnt nd flwng thrds; nly t hv thrs stmbl r fls strt r dgnrt nt csspl f th mcbr. Thnks fr bng thr.
[Editor: ignore=off]"OK, Judith. Point noted. Save the rest for the Free Zone. This thread is about the Teleban going broke, not scout or Bill."
Posted by pessimist at April 10, 2006 05:49 PM
Well, excuse me.
Posted by Judith at April 10, 2006 08:00 PMScout still creeps me out.
Posted by snark at April 10, 2006 08:34 PMHow could we leave out Dr. Dobson on this issue? My favorite loathing point.
Phidipides, as always, at the top of your sardonic dripping self! Thanks!
scout, I don't hate the right, wingnuts or bu$h. My sister is a large supporter.
I mostly feel sorry for them, for they know not what they do.
p, your right, neither do Bill or scout take up an unusual amount of bandwith. On my bad days I have taken things out personally on scout, I apologize.
Personally however, I do like it when scout keeps it shorter than 2 pages.
phidipides
Fucking hilarious... Great shot.>/p>
Posted by tempus at April 10, 2006 10:53 PMFirst, I'll pay my retainer. Pess, your eloquent quoting of news releases shows how brilliant you are! God, and I, love you! Kiss, kiss!
Now, can I call bullshit?
Posted by iamcoyote at April 11, 2006 08:43 AMCurrent Faux News banner for Cavuto:
"Are liberals goddless people?"
How can Kansas fall for this fake divisive crap the GOP spews out?
Posted by o.c. at April 11, 2006 10:47 AMFirst, I'll pay my retainer. Pess, your eloquent quoting of news releases shows how brilliant you are! God, and I, love you! Kiss, kiss! Now, can I call bullshit? Posted by iamcoyote at April 11, 2006 08:43 AM
Please do! Kissing up to me will get you absolutely nowhere. I'd much rather have honesty from you than love.
Posted by pessimist at April 11, 2006 11:20 AMPess: you are a friend, but you will have to kick over my gravestone before you get anywhere near Iamcoyote.
Posted by tempus at April 11, 2006 03:02 PMNot to worry, tempus! Mrs. P would never allow me to add to the staff (so to speak!)
Posted by pessimist at April 11, 2006 06:00 PMWhoa, tempus, you'll get people to talking! Pessimist, I was being snarky; I've only ever given you honesty. I figger you can handle it. And yes, I have issues with scout that I'll have to deal with. I'm mean to be so pokey, but I think you hurt Judith's feelings earlier. Chalk it up to a couple bad days?
Posted by iamcoyote at April 11, 2006 07:12 PMPess: I understand, and am sorry. It is just a bit of a hot-button issue at the moment. Please accept my apologies, but you have to defend what you have great respect for.
Tempus
Posted by tempus at April 11, 2006 08:38 PMJudith
If your still checking in on this thread, I apologize if I hurt your feelings earlier.
Posted by pessimist at April 11, 2006 08:43 PMIs this "Lonely Hearts Club" officially closed?
Posted by bbtb at April 12, 2006 10:36 AMWe're Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band,
Sit back and let the evening go
Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Heart's Club Band,
It's wonderful to be here, it's certainly a thrill,
You're such a lovely audience, we'd like to take you home with us, We'd love to take you home
Posted by tempus at April 12, 2006 12:09 PM